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RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 12:48:44 PM

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I'm a bit annoyed somebody said that: I was warming up to a crack about maybe Aneirin should have a look down the back of the sofa...

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I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 1:05:41 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Why would I not accept that? It's pretty self evident.
However, for a lot of religions, these sorts of proscriptions are part of the deal, and if you want the religion, you have to accept them, whether you like it or not. To my way of thinking, that's more of a loss of autonomy than choosing to go vegan or abhor the vertical slam dance, or whatever.

It is autonomous in that they chose to participate in that religion and they have chosen to accept the restrictions of that religion. At some point in time, adults of any faith, make a choice to live the life that their particular religion sets forth.

You may see it as confining and a loss of autonomy, and for you that would be true, but for others it is not at all.

You need look no further than this site to understand that not everyone wants/needs/desires to live in complete autonomy. I suspect that you would have no issue with a Dominant restricting their sub from a particular behavior, food, clothing choice ? Does that not make the sub as " bad " as a Mormon, Jew or Buddhist ? They are giving up complete autonomy for some one other than themselves. We give up complete autonomy all the time in life. Why does it really matter to you that some may chose to give up their autonomy to their God ? Why does that make religion " bad ". You have given up your autonomy by being owned, your owner has set down guidelines for your relationship. If you want to continue your relationship you must accept the word of your owner, like it or not. I see little difference in that than I do to a Mormon not drinking coffee.

I know you are a couple profile and I am not sure which party I am addressing, but if it is the Owner, just reverse what I said to you in the last paragraph.

mbmbn

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Tolerance of evil is suicide.- NYC Firefighter

When tolerance is not reciprocated, tolerance becomes surrender.

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 1:17:33 PM

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You're capable of making sweeping generalisations about religion while insisting that everybody who was raised in a religious faith had a choice in the matter?
How cute.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 1:51:40 PM

hertz

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quote:

God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?

Obviously, Nietzsche failed to spot this:

God hasn't gone anywhere. He's right here, in our pockets and in our hearts. Praise the Lord! Hallelujah!

Serious point (because there is one) - we'll always find something to worship, though we might deny it. Most of us dedicate our lives to the Church of the almighty Dollar nowadays. He's a harsh, vengeful God who showers his bounty upon the least deserving of us, but who amongst us is brave enough to say: 'No!'

It's a harsh world when your God turns his back on you. No-one wants that.

EDIT: Fixed broken link - our God is hard to grasp, sometimes...

< Message edited by hertz -- 12/6/2010 1:55:53 PM >

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 2:18:45 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
Rather than an undisciplined mine believing in fairytales I believe my beliefs are based in a thinking, calculating, discriminating mind trying to find the source of me.

I hope this doesn't sound snarky, Butch, but everybody thinks that. The Pope, Ayatollah Loseatscrabble, The Daily Llama, the twat Paisely, Gerry "Not A Fenian" Adams, the Archbishop of Canterbury, Fred fookin' Phelps, everybody.
Nobody ever thinks that they're being irrational. That's why they keep on doing it.

BUT, there is THINKING that you're being rational and then there is actually BEING rational.

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RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 2:20:30 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

If its all meaningless, what have we lost by believing?

the truth

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RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 2:25:12 PM

hertz

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But there is no truth.

(in reply to lickenforyou)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 2:49:07 PM

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OK, here you go, just got a call, he's down at the local pub, wants me to kip down for a pint after work.

What a fuckin guy, huh?

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to hertz)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 3:12:53 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

You're capable of making sweeping generalisations about religion while insisting that everybody who was raised in a religious faith had a choice in the matter?
How cute.

Don't re invent my post. I said " at some point int time, ADULTS of any faith..."
I assumed, silly me, that the reader of my post would understand that continuing in, changing, abandoning and/or re evaluating their faith is a choice. And the subsequent decision is also a choice.

How cute, that you avoided or chose not to comment on the rest of my post which was to do with autonomy. Which seem to be one of the root issues you have with religion, but not your life.

Peace,
mbmbn

_____________________________

Tolerance of evil is suicide.- NYC Firefighter

When tolerance is not reciprocated, tolerance becomes surrender.

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 3:36:55 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz

But there is no truth.

In the real world there is

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RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 4:11:09 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lickenforyou
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

If its all meaningless, what have we lost by believing?

the truth

Well damn, imagine that, God is right here among us!

Maybe he'll tell us what the truth is if we ask nicely.

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 12/6/2010 4:34:34 PM >

(in reply to lickenforyou)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 4:20:44 PM

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The Kingdom of God is inside you, and all around you, not in mansions of wood and stone. Split a piece of wood and I am there; lift a stone and you will find me.

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 5:10:43 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: maybemaybenot

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

You're capable of making sweeping generalisations about religion while insisting that everybody who was raised in a religious faith had a choice in the matter?
How cute.

Don't re invent my post. I said " at some point int time, ADULTS of any faith..."
I assumed, silly me, that the reader of my post would understand that continuing in, changing, abandoning and/or re evaluating their faith is a choice. And the subsequent decision is also a choice.

How cute, that you avoided or chose not to comment on the rest of my post which was to do with autonomy. Which seem to be one of the root issues you have with religion, but not your life.

Peace,
mbmbn

I was thinking of adults, to be honest. You know, women who get treated as second class citizens in fourteenth century theocracies, homosexuals who get tortured to death by shi'ites in Iraq since you guys deposed one of the few secular leaders in the middle east, like that.
That's without even mentioning that the only way you can leave the Islamic faith in a lot of the world is in a pine box. You want to leave before your time's up, a lot of people will be happy to put you in one. This is a particular problem for those Egyptian coptics who've been forcibly converted.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 8:45:48 PM

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God resides near a star called Kolob

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 8:49:50 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
The fact that my thinking is more common in mankind than yours may mean your thinking is irrational not mine.

The above is a fallacious argument known as Argumentum ad populum.

(in reply to kdsub)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 9:06:47 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lickenforyou

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

If its all meaningless, what have we lost by believing?

the truth

The truth according to whom? You are assuming you know what my truths are.

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to lickenforyou)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/6/2010 10:37:52 PM

kdsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
The fact that my thinking is more common in mankind than yours may mean your thinking is irrational not mine.

The above is a fallacious argument known as Argumentum ad populum.

In what way...all rationalities are determined by majority thinking. Do you deny that pure atheists and their thinking along with reasoning are but a small minority of the worlds population?

Then does it not follow if the vast majority agrees that your thinking is wrong then it could be by the majority considered lacking usual or normal mental clarity or coherence ? The very definition of irrational.

It is not about right or wrong...proof or lack of it… but simply how a tiny minorities way of thinking could be considered irrational by the vast majority whose way of thinking is directly in opposition.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 12/6/2010 10:56:13 PM >

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RE: Where is God ? - 12/7/2010 2:44:46 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: lickenforyou

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

If its all meaningless, what have we lost by believing?

the truth

The truth according to whom? You are assuming you know what my truths are.

The truth according to what can be proved. If you get a good feeling or some feeling of strength when you think of a god or whatever you believe in and you want to call that your truth, that's fine.

But if you think you already know then there's no reason to find out what is real. That is why most scientist don't believe in the supernatural. It is why they continue to try and uncover the truth.

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RE: Where is God ? - 12/7/2010 2:46:16 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: lickenforyou
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

If its all meaningless, what have we lost by believing?

the truth

Well damn, imagine that, God is right here among us!

Maybe he'll tell us what the truth is if we ask nicely.

K.

See my response to tazzygirl, smartass.

_____________________________

I changed my profile name to - toserveonlyYou - but am having trouble posting in the forums with that profile.

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Where is God ? - 12/7/2010 5:35:13 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Why would I not accept that? It's pretty self evident.
However, for a lot of religions, these sorts of proscriptions are part of the deal, and if you want the religion, you have to accept them, whether you like it or not. To my way of thinking, that's more of a loss of autonomy than choosing to go vegan or abhor the vertical slam dance, or whatever.

Yet you dont slam vegans for what they have to give up.

Now, lets take a look at what you have to give up. Catholics long have denounced birth control.

According to a recent Gallup Poll, 78 percent of American Catholics support allowing Catholics to use birth control, 63 percent think priests should be able to marry, and 55 percent think women should be ordained as priests. Last week Gallup reported that more Catholics than non-Catholics believe that homosexual behavior, divorce, and stem-cell and human-embryo research are morally acceptable. "The paradox," says David Gibson, author of The Coming Catholic Church, "is that while [the pope] was enormously popular, he did not necessarily change behavior" of the lay people in America.

2005...... http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/articles/050418/18american.htm

It seems that if someone belongs to a "religion", the belief is that person follows all tenents of that religion... and that simply isnt true.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Moonhead)

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