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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 8:14:40 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SomeCdnGuy

quote:

After all, if it isn't important to you, why should it be to her?
Because I told her to do it.

Sorry SCG, I have contempt for make work. And for the people who assign that. So you demanding something that didn't matter to you would mean I would find you contemptible and not worthy of respect. If that's the kind of response you want, then keep doing what you're doing.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 8:18:42 AM

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Do I lose my Dom Club membership card if I say all the Doms on this thread have been wrong and all the subs have been right?

All subs test their Doms. No matter how service oriented and insanely driven to please, eventually every sub tests their Dom. It is a natural and necessary part of the D/s dynamic. A "D/s" relationship without Domly expectations being tested is merely two compatibly kinky people playing together. (There is nothing wrong with that if that is what both parties desire.)

A submissive must be faced with things they would rather avoid, or it is a compatibly kinky relationship and not a D/s relationship. A submissive needs to know there are consequences for displeasing their Dom. Without consequences, they will just do what they want. An initially motivated submissive might only test a little at first by being slightly less perfect in their obedience. If the Dom does not impose a consequence for that, they have consented to that being the new expectation baseline. Eventually that new boundary will be tested with slightly more imperfection and again either the Dom imposes a consequence or has accepted a new lower expectation baseline. If the submissive can never find a point where the Dom gives a shit what they do, then their submission becomes an individual and possibly lonely act. Obeying in a vacuum could be compared to self-bondage or masturbation.

It is the responsibility of us Domly types to establish and impose consequences. If you do not derive some form of personal satisfaction from handling this responsibility, then you aren't really a Dom and instead you are looking for your compatibly kinky play partner.

I do have one caveat supporting the Domly's showing subs the door. For those of us who do not want to go to prison for assault and rape, there is necessarily a point where our only option is to show a defiant submissive the door. However, if ending the relationship is the only consequence of a submissive's natural need to test their Dom, then either the submissive will leave or the D/s dynamic in the relationship will fade away into a mutually unsatisfying existence.

(in reply to Giermo)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 8:32:51 AM

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I guess I'm not twue.

I never test him. I don't need to. I'm an adult. He says, I do. It's that simple. I don't need to feel his dominance or wonder if he'll go through with something.

I find it immature and something that usually newbies or SAMs do, neither of which I am.

I'm calling bullshit on your stance dominanthunger.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 8:35:34 AM

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You just turned yourself over for TPE right off the bat?

(in reply to littlewonder)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 8:38:32 AM

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actually yes I did. The moment I met him I felt comfortable with him and just did it.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 8:41:02 AM

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eep

(in reply to littlewonder)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 8:44:10 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

I guess I'm not twue.

I never test him. I don't need to. I'm an adult. He says, I do. It's that simple. I don't need to feel his dominance or wonder if he'll go through with something.

I find it immature and something that usually newbies or SAMs do, neither of which I am.

I'm calling bullshit on your stance dominanthunger.

The two of you are merely compatibly kinky. There's nothing wrong with that. If you just naturally want to obey everything so completely that you never, ever, ever, succumb to the desire to take some itty-bitty short cut, then you are not submitting to anything. You are just being you. Maybe compatibly kinky isn't the right term for your relationship. What about leader and follower? Again, not D/s, but a perfectly decent kind of relationship to have.

Brats and SAMs are pushing the testing concept too far. That's the point the door needs to be shown to them (unless you are one of those who enjoy the constant battling they create, which I am not).

< Message edited by DominantHunger -- 1/26/2012 8:51:08 AM >

(in reply to littlewonder)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 9:08:14 AM

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I'm not a fan of intentional testing, and have no desire to do it. Bratting and SAMming just drive me bananas - but I'm also not going to aspire to instantly turn myself over to TPE. I don't think that's a superior way to be, either.

I have to disagree with Dominanthunger a little. When I met my last Person, i felt really comfortable with him. It was a natural, normal thing to follow his lead. I couldnn't explain it. But I did have momennts when I balked or had doubts or over-thought thinngs. I donn't believe those are negative things, as the ascription to "newbieism" makes it seem.

Those are normal human things, and there's nothing wrong with them.

< Message edited by LillyBoPeep -- 1/26/2012 9:12:12 AM >

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 9:09:24 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantHunger

Do I lose my Dom Club membership card if I say all the Doms on this thread have been wrong and all the subs have been right?

I take it that you didn't read my post?

(in reply to DominantHunger)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 9:45:37 AM

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Yeah, if I am gonna be tested as a Dom, its gonna be multiple choice and the slave will be fillin in the blanks.........

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 9:47:59 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep

I'm not a fan of intentional testing, and have no desire to do it. Bratting and SAMming just drive me bananas - but I'm also not going to aspire to instantly turn myself over to TPE. I don't think that's a superior way to be, either.

I have to disagree with Dominanthunger a little. When I met my last Person, i felt really comfortable with him. It was a natural, normal thing to follow his lead. I couldnn't explain it. But I did have momennts when I balked or had doubts or over-thought thinngs. I donn't believe those are negative things, as the ascription to "newbieism" makes it seem.

Those are normal human things, and there's nothing wrong with them.

I hate harping on dictionary definitions and find arguing semantics annoying... however...

I think the only disagreement is whether we are semantically talking Dom/sub or leader/follower. I do not have a critique of one over the other. My relationship with Ishtar is most definitely not Dom/sub and is a leader/follower kind of relationship.

When you said you balked - going by the dictionary definition of "balked", it sounds like you did test to some minor degree - possibly merely a hesitation rather than blindly following. Maybe the test was answered by just a stern look. Maybe it was by a non-correctional approach through his solid leadership. Maybe you did not test at all because your Dom was completely on top of his responsibilities as a Dom that you naturally surrendered.

Overall I think we are saying the exact same thing. Each relationship is different and there is no one right answer. My core point has been that it is inappropriate to be condemning a submissive for testing their Dom when it is the Dom's responsibility to be gaining the submissive's surrender. The tone of all the Doms proudly proclaiming the sub would be shown the door was abdicating the Dom's responsibility to be the dominant force in the relationship and instead blaming the submissive for having not been properly dominated.

I'll repeat from a prior post for clarity that there is a point a rebellious sub needs to be shown the door. However, I find it inappropriate to make that your blanket answer for having been tested. The first step a Dom needs to take when being tested is to look at their own approach and determine if there is something lacking in their handling of their sub. Failing to do that is akin to a rancher failing to put up a sturdy fence and blaming the cows for pushing through it.

(in reply to LillyBoPeep)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 10:26:10 AM

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I think that Dominant Hunger's definition of "tested" is different from mine. We test each other all the time in relationships. I test those who think they want to serve me in subtle ways. I expect that they are doing the same to me--TO SEE WHAT I WILL DO. I also expect to be questioned if I've made some kind of oddball request that is just not a good idea. Questioned properly, not told off.

My interpretation of "testing", and I think DarkSteven's also (?) is open defiance, that PROVE to me that you're a domly dom. Which I do, by giving the person a chance to rephrase what they said. And yes, if that's their communication style, telling them that they are not meant to be in a relationship with me.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 10:42:17 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

I think that Dominant Hunger's definition of "tested" is different from mine. We test each other all the time in relationships. I test those who think they want to serve me in subtle ways. I expect that they are doing the same to me--TO SEE WHAT I WILL DO. I also expect to be questioned if I've made some kind of oddball request that is just not a good idea. Questioned properly, not told off.

My interpretation of "testing", and I think DarkSteven's also (?) is open defiance, that PROVE to me that you're a domly dom. Which I do, by giving the person a chance to rephrase what they said. And yes, if that's their communication style, telling them that they are not meant to be in a relationship with me.

You may be right. I do agree with what you've said here.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 10:52:59 AM

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I'm glad, because I did get a distinct "you're doing it wrong" vibe from your post.

The fact is, we are not suited to every submissive, and not every submissive is suited to us. I am always interested in expanding my horizons and learning new things, but I am not going to change my self or my style to match someone who is either dead wrong, or just plain not interested in being submissive. I am not going to feel badly about myself because of that, either. Everyone has those "bad days" and an occasional outburst is something that I would investigate, to see if it was ME, an anger management issue, or something else. If it's that I am not meeting the fantasy, or that he/she is not able or interested in meeting my needs, it's time to say sayonara, no harm no foul.

This is where I say that I am not EVERYONE'S dominant. :)

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 11:00:28 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

The way I look at it, if we are constantly 'testing' then we are probably not right for one another.

Testing to ME, indicates a lack of trust in ability or knowledge. Not to be confused with playful behaviour.

I was just thinking about how, in the past, I've allowed boundaries to be run over. I didn't listen to my gut and I didn't understand a s-types need for boundaries. And.......I didn't understand why the relationship faltered. I was still stuck in the societal mindset of equal and fair relationships. Even now I have occasional knee jerk reactions that I have to mentally slap myself out of.

I also wonder if that is why some D/M types prefer to not love their slave/submissive. Because there is that internal struggle at the onset of figuring all of this out. In a loving relationship we do want the other person/s happy. It can be difficult for some of us D/M sorts to understand that the boundaries that temporarily make a 's' unhappy, are the very boundaries they need in that relationship to be happy and thrive.....big picture.

I see a huge difference between testing and topping from the bottom.

If I am mouthy or resistant when the man wants sex, then its topping. When I do that with the knowledge that the small amount of resistance I put up turns him on, then I am not longer topping.

I like boundaries.. on certain things. If those boundary lines are disappearing, or they seem suddenly grey to me, Im going to push them. The more I have to push to feel them, the worse I get.

Now, if I hide this fact, then the blame is on me. I dont hide it, its known from the beginning. And, yes, LaT, you would be right. If those boundaries dont snap back into place, we arent meant for each other.

But, I wonder if maybe, instead of seeing the testing as a bad thing, it should be looked at as if, maybe, something is missing.

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(in reply to LaTigresse)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 11:19:02 AM

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I agree with LadyHib on this one... I think my definition of testing is different, too.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 11:41:36 AM

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quote:

I think that Dominant Hunger's definition of "tested" is different from mine. We test each other all the time in relationships. I test those who think they want to serve me in subtle ways. I expect that they are doing the same to me--TO SEE WHAT I WILL DO. I also expect to be questioned if I've made some kind of oddball request that is just not a good idea. Questioned properly, not told off.

My interpretation of "testing", and I think DarkSteven's also (?) is open defiance, that PROVE to me that you're a domly dom. Which I do, by giving the person a chance to rephrase what they said. And yes, if that's their communication style, telling them that they are not meant to be in a relationship with me.

My definition of testing is much more subtle.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 11:44:56 AM

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More subtle than mine? Examples, pls!

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 11:45:31 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

I'm glad, because I did get a distinct "you're doing it wrong" vibe from your post.

That's how I felt reading the initial show-em-the-door posts - except I hadn't stated a position yet.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 11:50:22 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

quote:

ORIGINAL: xXLithiumXx

I had a female sub for about 9 months. I gave her a set schedule, I gave her tasks, I gave her about a million and one reasonable guidelines that were meant to change the behavior she addressed having issues with.

Every. Single. Fecking. Step. She fought. She had excuses. She whined. She complained. She threw fits. She cried! She had tantrums that could have been in a competitive two year old event. I am NOT even kidding.

I would have too.

To the OP I have pushed at boundaries from time to time, a kind of morbid curiosity but I have never tested dominance, if I didn't feel it then there would be no D/s there to push.

She -asked- for these things. She stated she was sick of arriving late for work, she was sick of not having time to do the things she wanted to do. She is the one that asked for the guidelines, I just gave her guidelines to adhere to.

But, I was under the impression that the job of the dominant was to guide the sub, and to teach them to manage themselves, IF that sub were incapable or UNwilling to do so themselves.

I am talking about a 30 year old woman that couldn't find time to clean her house or walk her dog because she was too busy playing Diner Dash on her computer.

I made more than reasonable and ample effort to include the things she -wanted- to do, with the things she -needed- to do to maintain her life. Like, work, clean house, cook meals, pay bills, not over spend...

Sorry, I expected her to be a grown up.

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(in reply to LillyoftheVally)

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