RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack....

RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (Full Version)

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Nosathro -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 8:41:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro First Off no medical records have been made public to show Zimmerman nose was broken. We know the medical records exist though. quote: Considering that onle a paramedic, not a doctored reteated him and he was never in the a hospital or a wore a nose brace I have alot of trouble believe his nose was broken. Zimmerman went to the hospital the next day, according to Sanford police, and it was stated clearly at a court hearing that his nose was broken. Then let see the records

Raiikun -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 8:44:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail His necktie says his nose was broken, with no actual proffer of proof, that is not the same thing as it happening. You seem to have no trouble accepting the existence of the donation money though...and the information about that came from the same source.

Raiikun -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 8:46:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro Then let see the records And that goes for you as well. You were debating as if you have no trouble accepting the donation money was real, and that information came from the same source that stated clearly in court that Zimmerman's nose was broken. Why all the picking and choosing what you want to believe is real, even when it comes from the same source?

Moonhead -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 8:47:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun Why all the picking and choosing what you want to believe is real, even when it comes from the same source? Because that's all the fun of these pissing matches. (Obvs.) [;)]

Real0ne -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 8:48:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro The so-called burgulary tool was a screw diver. I'm quite aware of what it was. I am also aware that a 17-year-old student has no need for a screwdriver at school. In many districts, they consider that a weapon. There have been girls expelled for having a fingernail file. A screwdriver is no different in the hands of a high school student. My point is that the school used it as an excuse to suspended Martin. yep the kids get these 3/8's thick screwdrivers and you can break into pretty much anything less than a steel security door with them. Sounds like th eschool knows the gig.

mnottertail -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 8:52:26 AM)
Well, that is not the only source. and so what? The thing about any of the other stories is that we have from the Zimster more than one version. You believe in the central nervous system? Why not chi lines and meridians? I believe there were Nazis. I do not believe they had good intentions towards the Jews. There is nothing aberrant in that consistency. Nor is there in the belief that he did not have a broken nose and he got a paypal account. Again, there has been no proof forwarded, and he hasnt got black eyes now and never had. God could punch the virgin mary in the fucking nose, breaking it, and by god, she would have black eyes, miracle or no, you cannot prevent the bursting of that vein and the sinuses filling up with blood, and they dont go away in an hour. or a day, or a week.

Raiikun -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 9:13:15 AM)
O'Mara says something that can be spun against Zimmerman in court: OMG proof Zimmerman is a liar! O'Mara says Zimmerman took an injury and will submit the records : OMG, I don't believe the injury is real without proof! Yeah, I think I'm done here, I prefer a little more intellectual honesty in people I debate with.

Nosathro -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 9:16:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro Then let see the records And that goes for you as well. You were debating as if you have no trouble accepting the donation money was real, and that information came from the same source that stated clearly in court that Zimmerman's nose was broken. Why all the picking and choosing what you want to believe is real, even when it comes from the same source? Well that same source is not a Doctor

mnottertail -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 9:23:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun O'Mara says something that can be spun against Zimmerman in court: OMG proof Zimmerman is a liar! O'Mara says Zimmerman took an injury and will submit the records : OMG, I don't believe the injury is real without proof! Yeah, I think I'm done here, I prefer a little more intellectual honesty in people I debate with. Why do you require something of others that you have demonstrated clearly and repeatedly you do not have? The lawyer, if he had the documents of the broken nose would produce them given the shakey environment he is in. So, we can suspect that there is an legal argument afoot regarding what could be considered a broken nose. And I think when paypal commented that that account existed, is what swung me to belief on that. So your intellectual dishonesty is again shining brightly in the garish light of day. And for your further intellectual dishonesty, the documents that were pertinent to the paypal fiasco were given to the court. Didn't have any trouble getting those papers together at all.

Moonhead -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 11:22:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro Then let see the records And that goes for you as well. You were debating as if you have no trouble accepting the donation money was real, and that information came from the same source that stated clearly in court that Zimmerman's nose was broken. Why all the picking and choosing what you want to believe is real, even when it comes from the same source? Well that same source is not a Doctor David says: "Zimmy has a broken nose." [image]http://i2.listal.com/image/252141/936full-david-tennant.jpg[/image]

Politesub53 -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 11:37:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro Then let see the records And that goes for you as well. You were debating as if you have no trouble accepting the donation money was real, and that information came from the same source that stated clearly in court that Zimmerman's nose was broken. Why all the picking and choosing what you want to believe is real, even when it comes from the same source? Your own intellectual dishonesty in this debate makes me laugh, you cherry pick parts of a statement that support your defence of Zimmerman, while ignoring the facts that dont. Then you have the nerve to accuse others of doing the very same fling and you threaten to flounce out of the debate. You have posted elsewere the text of what was said in court, so i will do you a favour and use the same. This quote is very telling though, because the detective says the evidnce points to Zimmermans version of what took place to be a lie. quote: UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Gilbreath, I didn't know we were going to be trying the case, I'm going to add up -- I apologize. I want to add some questions to -- you had reviewed or other members of the team had reviewed his interviews, is that not true. GILBREATH: That is -- UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And he gave -- he the defendant gave numerous interviews to the police did he not. GILBREATH: Yes. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And isn't it true that a lot of statements that he made do not make sense in terms of the injuries that he described. Did he not describe to the police that Mr. Martin had him on the ground and kept bashing his head on the concrete over and over and just physically beating him with his hands? GILBREATH: He has said that, yes. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And isn't it true that there is evidence that indicates that's not true? GILBREATH: Yes.

Raiikun -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 11:40:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 Your own intellectual dishonesty in this debate makes me laugh, you cherry pick parts of a statement that support your defence of Zimmerman, while ignoring the facts that dont. And now you're just lying.

Raiikun -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 11:47:24 AM)
And now as far as that investigator quote...what evidence is that? We don't know yet. What does the evidence show that contrasts his story? We don't know yet. There's not a whole lot to discuss there yet until we know more. Oh and, quote: Then you have the nerve to accuse others of doing the very same fling and you threaten to flounce out of the debate. Actually that's not what I was doing...I just put him on ignore. Which I shall now do the same with you. I lost count how many times you demanded evidence of something I didn't claim, and how many times I had to repeat what I was actually claiming...and I'm tired of it. It's the same thing that finally led me to finally putting Tazzy on ignore as well.

thishereboi -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 12:39:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro First Off no medical records have been made public to show Zimmerman nose was broken. We know the medical records exist though. quote: Considering that onle a paramedic, not a doctored reteated him and he was never in the a hospital or a wore a nose brace I have alot of trouble believe his nose was broken. Zimmerman went to the hospital the next day, according to Sanford police, and it was stated clearly at a court hearing that his nose was broken. Then let see the records Why? So zimmy can claim he can't get a fair trial because they can't find a jury that hasn't already read all the reports and formed an opinion on the case.

Moonhead -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 1:49:59 PM)
Is publishing a few reports going to make any difference to that? A mistrial being declared is the idiot's only hope at this point.

Raiikun -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 2:26:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead Is publishing a few reports going to make any difference to that? A mistrial being declared is the idiot's only hope at this point. I dunno about that...Florida acquitted Casey Anthony after all, and the evidence against her was IMO more compelling than what we see against Zimmerman. Maybe that'll change after discovery, but right now most legal experts seem to think that there's a very low chance of Zimmerman being convicted.

Politesub53 -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 4:18:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 Your own intellectual dishonesty in this debate makes me laugh, you cherry pick parts of a statement that support your defence of Zimmerman, while ignoring the facts that dont. And now you're just lying. In what way ?....... You quoted the part about Zimmerman getting his nose broken but failed to metion the investigating detective said he could disprove Zimmermans statement (All of this from the hearing transcription). I accused you of cherry picking, so how is that lying. My guess is your pissy at posts you dont like and resorting to personal attacks by accusing me of lying.

Politesub53 -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 4:19:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun And now as far as that investigator quote...what evidence is that? We don't know yet. What does the evidence show that contrasts his story? We don't know yet. There's not a whole lot to discuss there yet until we know more. Oh and, quote: Then you have the nerve to accuse others of doing the very same fling and you threaten to flounce out of the debate. Actually that's not what I was doing...I just put him on ignore. Which I shall now do the same with you. I lost count how many times you demanded evidence of something I didn't claim, and how many times I had to repeat what I was actually claiming...and I'm tired of it. It's the same thing that finally led me to finally putting Tazzy on ignore as well. Ah yes, ignore those that see through your bullshit...very grown up behaviour.

DarqueMirror -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 10:32:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 You missed the posts about the photos being of someone else then ? You mean the "claims" that they are someone else, yes. The proof? No. quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 As for the claim Zimmermans head was being repeatedly smashed on the floor thats bullshit. It may or may not have happened but there is no evidence that it did. Innocent until proven guilty means you have to show that it did not happen. We don't have to prove that it did.

DarqueMirror -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (4/30/2012 10:34:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead The fact that Zimmerman is the one standing trial rather than the corpse could well be taken as evidence that it didn't happen that way. If somebody's following you about and you can't get away from them, I suspect that if you get him down, you don't stop pounding his head off the floor until you know he won't be giving you any more aggro. Wrong. Police in many, many jurisdictions would call that battery at best...attempted murder at worst. If you're not armed and someone attacks, you can defend yourself enough to get them down. When they are down, if you don't stop, you've exceeded the confines of self defense.

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