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RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/21/2013 6:12:43 PM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko

quote:

ORIGINAL: wannapleez

If I could edit a post more than once, I'd add

Actually, I do believe you can edit a post more than once. It does, though, time out. You only have an hour or so to make changes to your post, then it's locked. But those changes can be multiple within that time frame.

This, by the way, would make another great factoid question on my entrance test that I will initiate when I become a moderator.

You have my vote!

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Post #: 21

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/21/2013 6:36:14 PM

TheLilSquaw

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From: Middle River, MD
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wannapleez

If I could edit a post more than once, I'd add

* The person with lousy reading comprehension skills who rolls over to the status quo

I said twice in the OP that help can be found. I also noted that there's a lot of shit to be waded through in order to find it. That may very well be the way it is; it's cowardly to think that that's the way it always has to be.

If you don't want to call out the assholes, that's fine. But please stay the hell out of the way of those of us who do.

I do call out those "I" consider assholes.
IMO your response to me is assholeish but eh.. obviously our mileage varies.
IMO this OP is whiney but eh my mileage obviously varies from yours.

Even offline YOU have to wade through shit.
Whether it is in a casual social setting or dating.
So why should online be any different?
Again, not everyone is here to pat folks on the head and blindly agree simply because they are new and might not be able to take it.

Just an idea perhaps its YOUR lousy social skills that are the problem not anyone else's reading comprehension.

< Message edited by TheLilSquaw -- 1/21/2013 6:42:28 PM >

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Post #: 22

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/21/2013 6:48:25 PM

LadyPact

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I get laid plenty, thanks. I still get annoyed when people can't bother to research the equivalent of 2+2=4 questions. Sorry, but I'm not here for the pre-K class and this isn't AA where the newcomer is the most important person in the room.

I don't mean any offense, but at least make some kind of effort. See what google has to say or check out an FAQ. Yeah, I know a lot of stuff, but I'm not willing to spend more time typing out explanations for your kink education than you are. Show Me that you are willing to do more than sit back and wait for people to bring you what you need on a silver platter, and we'll get along fine. A person who just wants Me to hand them the Reader's Digest version of kink education isn't going to do well with Me.

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Post #: 23

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/21/2013 7:21:54 PM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheLilSquaw
Just an idea perhaps its YOUR lousy social skills that are the problem not anyone else's reading comprehension.

When I keep saying over and over that this is not about me (but about how others are treated), and you keep ascribing it to me, I'm pretty damn sure we can chalk that up to your reading comprehension.

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Post #: 24

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/21/2013 7:26:40 PM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

I get laid plenty, thanks. I still get annoyed when people can't bother to research the equivalent of 2+2=4 questions. Sorry, but I'm not here for the pre-K class and this isn't AA where the newcomer is the most important person in the room.

I don't mean any offense, but at least make some kind of effort. See what google has to say or check out an FAQ. Yeah, I know a lot of stuff, but I'm not willing to spend more time typing out explanations for your kink education than you are. Show Me that you are willing to do more than sit back and wait for people to bring you what you need on a silver platter, and we'll get along fine. A person who just wants Me to hand them the Reader's Digest version of kink education isn't going to do well with Me.

I have no problem with anyone getting annoyed. Especially if it's with someone who clearly shows that he's unwilling to do any research. But

(A) This is another example of the kind of newbie that I'm not talking about
(B) But, even if it was, the response to that should be to ignore the newbie, not to be an asshole to him.

(I'm not saying that you are doing that; rather, just pointing out the distinction based on what you said.)

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Post #: 25

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 12:43:16 AM

AthenaSurrenders

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You know, sometimes we do pile on and we aren't as welcoming as we could be. That's something I try really hard to be conscious of and I try to take the time to give a sensible answer as much as possible because sometimes with a bit of a nudge in the right direction, that new person might become a great poster.

I think that a lot of people get jumped on not because their question is a simple one or a newbie one, but because they act in a way that is inappropriate for the board. They might come in and immediately spew a graphic sexual fantasy, repeatedly post the same question, type entirely in text speak, have a gaping butthole avatar or a number of other things completely inappropriate for the culture of the board. There are places where that kind of behaviour fits right in, but not here. Basic social skills would suggest a new poster read some threads and get a sense of how the board works, what goes down well, what makes people cross and so on. When you join a club or go into a new bar you do this. It would be inappropriate to go to a speed dating night and say to every woman 'I've got a huge hairy penis and I love to ram it down a woman's throat'. Most people are aware enough of social cues to figure this out without being told. When people come in and ignore those cues, it annoys people because it shows a basic disrespect and laziness. So yes, they get a hard time. And in most cases, when they accept they acted inappropriately people are much kinder. I've seen many regular posters say some variation of 'since you're able to take criticism you'll do well here' or 'don't worry I've been there'. When they defend their poor manners by spewing 'WTF it's a kink site how dare you it's a free world!' then yes, they get jumped on and I don't care.

People who post just common questions, or ones that could be solved in less than a minute on google might get told about it, but very rarely attacked or insulted. Unless these people are very sensitive and fragile and take offense at the slightest thing, in which case perhaps the internet is not for them.

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Post #: 26

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 1:11:09 AM

NiceButMeanGirl

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I admit that, at one time, I would frequently get really irritated at people who would ask a question for the millionth time instead of doing their own research, but now I just refer them to the As a Mistress FAQ. It's a lot easier and a lot less snarky. I'm not saying I never get snarky anymore, but hardly ever now.

NBMG

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Post #: 27

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 1:12:22 AM

LadyPact

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wannapleez
I have no problem with anyone getting annoyed. Especially if it's with someone who clearly shows that he's unwilling to do any research. But

(A) This is another example of the kind of newbie that I'm not talking about
(B) But, even if it was, the response to that should be to ignore the newbie, not to be an asshole to him.

(I'm not saying that you are doing that; rather, just pointing out the distinction based on what you said.)

You're not exactly describing the kind of newbie that you are talking about, either.

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Post #: 28

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 1:14:56 AM

DaddySatyr

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DO NOT post to a thread that's more than 90 days old but don't ask a question that's already been covered.

Makes complete sense. Then, when someone who's new and a bit confused happens to violate one of these immensely important tenets, upon which the very balance of all human life as we know it hangs, they're chewed up and spit out. Making more complete sense if one wants to foster free and open discussion.

(or something like that)

Peace and comfort,

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Post #: 29

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 8:12:16 AM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
You're not exactly describing the kind of newbie that you are talking about, either.

First off, let me be sure to be clear that I wasn't getting on your case for addressing the "wrong" kind of newbie. I was just distinguishing.

That said, you just crystallized the whole problem. Thank you -- genuinely -- I'm not being a smartass.

You are absolutely correct. I have not described the kind of newbie that I'm talking about. Yet the majority of the responses I got either:

(A) assumed that I was referring to a newbie who probably could use a swat or two on the ass (and not in the fun way) or
(B) didn't actually assume that, but directed their response solely or primarily toward such a person

And there's the problem. Based on no evidence whatsoever, too many people assume the worst.

I could try to delineate exactly the kind of newbie I was talking about (respectful, nice avatar, question is not common, etc.) but someone would come along and think of another (unacceptable) behavior that I forgot to address (and say that the newbie didn't do that either). And a lot of them would be doing it just to excuse their own nasty behavior. My mom made me quit grasping at straws and making inapplicable, lame excuses when I was 7. If there are 7-year-olds on this board, then security is pretty lax.

I'm not saying that we all have to be Mr Rogers 24/7. But there are WAY too many people on this board who seem to live by the credo, "If you're new, you must be an idiot, an asshole, or probably both" based on no evidence to support that theory. And then they treat newbies accordingly.

Maybe I'm just naive, but I would've thought that people in this lifestyle would be above average in tolerating and helping the newbie. Let's face it -- even for the newbie with perfect motives and perfect behavior, this lifestyle can be pretty damn scary when you first dip your big toe in. Not to mention the fact that -- by general society's standards -- we are the weirdos. If someone wants in this tent, maybe we shouldn't ram something up their ass (at least until they request it).

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Post #: 30

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 8:15:38 AM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NiceButMeanGirl

I admit that, at one time, I would frequently get really irritated at people who would ask a question for the millionth time instead of doing their own research, but now I just refer them to the As a Mistress FAQ. It's a lot easier and a lot less snarky. I'm not saying I never get snarky anymore, but hardly ever now.

NBMG

Exactly. Especially the "It's a lot easier" part. If an oldbie thinks that the newbie is wasting his/her time, it takes a lot more effort to be an asshole to him than it does to either ignore him altogether or direct them to a FAQ, like you do.

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Post #: 31

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 8:17:01 AM

AthenaSurrenders

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Meh, the newbies that behave nicely have generally been treated nicely as far as I've seen.

But I think you are naive in thinking that because people are kinky they will be more tolerant than the population at large. That's just not how human beings work. People who are mean, elitist, or prejudiced will behave that way regardless of their own personal tastes. Some people just need to make themselves feel special or put others down to feel better about themselves. Like most personality traits, it doesn't get switched off when someone picks up a whip.

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Post #: 32

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 8:17:23 AM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

... these immensely important tenets, upon which the very balance of all human life as we know it hangs ...

I guess, at the end of the day, the people I'm decrying are the ones who act like they don't realize that you were being sarcastic.

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Post #: 33

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 8:26:15 AM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AthenaSurrenders
Meh, the newbies that behave nicely have generally been treated nicely as far as I've seen.

That may be your experience, and someone else cited a similar thing earlier in the thread. But that's not what I have seen.

quote:

ORIGINAL: AthenaSurrenders
But I think you are naive in thinking that because people are kinky they will be more tolerant than the population at large. That's just not how human beings work. People who are mean, elitist, or prejudiced will behave that way regardless of their own personal tastes. Some people just need to make themselves feel special or put others down to feel better about themselves. Like most personality traits, it doesn't get switched off when someone picks up a whip.

I wasn't saying that going into the lifestyle automagically makes you a wonderful person. My point is that I would think that the overall average of tolerance and patience would be a bit higher in the lifestyle (at least among those who have been it for a while). Hell, general society doesn't tolerate us one bit. We're sickos, perverts (and not in the good sense), mentally deranged, and dangerous. Then we find a group that accepts our predilections, desires, etc. This should be a clue to at least some that maybe these aren't the people to attack.

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Post #: 34

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 8:37:35 AM

AthenaSurrenders

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Just to play devil's advocate, you could argue that people are less tolerant of newcomers BECAUSE of the bad reputation we have in society. People who have had to struggle to find acceptance, who work hard in the community to improve the reputation of BDSM and D/s, and who have spent years listening to incorrect assumptions about their lifestyles might well be defensive of what they do. Therefore have less patience when people come in asking 'silly' questions, suggesting things which are reckless, or spouting fantasy nonsense, because they fear these people will undo some of their hard work by doing something stupid and getting bad publicity. They might appear to be short or snappy with people for asking a beginner level question or something that has been asked frequently because they are thinking that these people are diving in without doing even the most basic research.

The assumption is that because they have experienced exclusion they will be welcoming, but it is just as possible that they would want to close ranks to protect themselves.

I'm not saying this is happening - because honestly I've never felt that society finds me dangerous, deranged, perverted or intolerable - but going with your premise, I still wouldn't expect them to be more accepting.

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Post #: 35

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 9:08:48 AM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AthenaSurrenders

Just to play devil's advocate, you could argue that people are less tolerant of newcomers BECAUSE of the bad reputation we have in society. People who have had to struggle to find acceptance, who work hard in the community to improve the reputation of BDSM and D/s, and who have spent years listening to incorrect assumptions about their lifestyles might well be defensive of what they do. Therefore have less patience when people come in asking 'silly' questions, suggesting things which are reckless, or spouting fantasy nonsense, because they fear these people will undo some of their hard work by doing something stupid and getting bad publicity. They might appear to be short or snappy with people for asking a beginner level question or something that has been asked frequently because they are thinking that these people are diving in without doing even the most basic research.

The assumption is that because they have experienced exclusion they will be welcoming, but it is just as possible that they would want to close ranks to protect themselves.

I'm not saying this is happening - because honestly I've never felt that society finds me dangerous, deranged, perverted or intolerable - but going with your premise, I still wouldn't expect them to be more accepting.

I see your point and I agree with a lot of it, except for one part (but it's kinda critical to my argument):

The assumption is that because they have experienced exclusion they will be welcoming

My assumption is that because they have experienced exclusion -- but then finally found inclusion -- they will be less than assholes to others seeking the same.

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Post #: 36

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 9:14:18 AM

wannapleez

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Case in point: SylvereApLeanan created a thread called Feminization: Help, Advice & Support , and declared it to be a "safe zone" to discuss the topic without ridicule.

That this was done is quite laudable.

That this had to be done is stupid.

That this had to be done here is asinine.

And that this had to be done is pretty much slam-dunk supportive of my overall point.

< Message edited by wannapleez -- 1/22/2013 9:16:05 AM >

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Post #: 37

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 9:36:18 AM

DaddySatyr

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wannapleez

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

... these immensely important tenets, upon which the very balance of all human life as we know it hangs ...

I guess, at the end of the day, the people I'm decrying are the ones who act like they don't realize that you were being sarcastic.

Yes, while the sarcasm was not meant to be a show of disrespect to you or your opinion, I have been snarky for a little bit here.

I just looked at the calendar and realized why. Today is a bad "anniversay" (of sorts. It hasn't been a year) and my last few posts have been a bit more edgy than usual.

Having said all that; I agree with your posts and we had a thread similar to this a few months back. In that thread, I was making some of the same points that you have made.

I referred to the "Collar Chat Clique" (CCC) and was taken to task by quite a few. As is one of the common tactics on these forums, the CCC decided to resort to name calling, etc. and the thread was pulled but one of the moderators provided me with screen captures of my posts so that I could refer back to them.

With that in my rearview mirror, I can tell you that you are attempting to empty the ocean with a teaspoon. I admire your stance and the way you've gone about it and comported yourself but I refer you to Mathew 7:6.

Peace and comfort,

Michael

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Post #: 38

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 10:02:51 AM

theRose4U

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Oh goodie butthurt ATL is back!!
Your entire forum history is "how do I tattle on or spot a fake, how do I make kink all about my penis & how do change the rules to make every woman want my penis"...but this all OUR FAULT. Ummmm yeeeeeaaaaaah gotcha! Will get right on that!

Before yet another focused cutting snark at your target audience, you might consider there is a record for any woman that would even consider you to see your attitude towards those giving you advice, how badly it's received & the lack of respect for women in general (not just dommes)

But hey glad to see "educating all of us" has worked for ya!!

(You know because you, your & us is all hypothetical just to "fix everyone" so these hypothetical subs that aren't you get the picture)

< Message edited by theRose4U -- 1/22/2013 10:43:49 AM >

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Post #: 39

RE: suggested addition to FAQ - 1/22/2013 10:51:18 AM

wannapleez

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
Yes, while the sarcasm was not meant to be a show of disrespect to you or your opinion

Oh, I didn't take it that way at all. I read your response as being an affirmation of what I was saying, albeit brilliantly scathing. I was just saying that it's pretty obvious that there are people here who firmly believe what you said tongue-in-cheek as actually being true.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
With that in my rearview mirror, I can tell you that you are attempting to empty the ocean with a teaspoon.

Oh, I have no illusions of trying to change anything. But I do reserve the right to bitch about it. :)

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Post #: 40

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