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RE: Anotther school shooting. - 12/24/2013 2:45:03 PM   
EdBowie


Posts: 875
Joined: 8/11/2013
Status: offline 		You are pointing out a math problem that doesn't exist. Of course the number of armed people would be smaller in a one room school house as opposed to a high school of 1,500 or a university of 15K.

When the legislature passes a blanket law allowing all employees and teachers to carry on campus with a CCW, the factors I mentioned are in play across the board.
It doesn't matter if a bus driver is only on campus during the times they are picking up, or dropping off kids, they would be armed if something happened while they were there.

It is a political feel-good bandaid solution with a very real potential for a worst case scenario that I think should be avoided.

It is rooted in the notion that even though we have armed police in many schools now, and they have been instrumental in stopping these spree shooters before they could finish the job so to speak, that a cheaper, unworkable, 'fix' is preferable.
And that somehow, the next person bent on going out in a blaze of death, will suddenly decide "Gosh, I sure would like to shoot up the school today, but Mrs. Grimbley might get mad at me, and she's got a gun"...




quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

Just pointing out the problems with your math.
Move the total employees to 200 and statistically that would still only have 10 people with permits.
With at least half of them teachers it cuts the number down more.
As I stated in another post armed guards are much better.
I have never been around a school system were each school has their own busses.
All of them I have seen shared busses among various levels of schools.
Thus the busses were in a centralized location, thus the bus drivers spend 0 time inside the schools.



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RE: Anotther school shooting. - 12/24/2013 3:08:11 PM   
EdBowie


Posts: 875
Joined: 8/11/2013
Status: offline 		Sounds good, but the fact is that many service personnel never see CQB combat, and unless they were military police, haven't been trained to the legal or tactical standard needed in a civilian encounter.

Just being a clerk in the Air Force, or a cook in the Coast Guard and a taking a CCW class does not automatically confer the abilities best suited to the task.
Even SF don't get the appropriate training.
Nor does it make up for the fact that police have communications and other equipment that make them a much better choice for dealing with an active shooter situation.

So a teacher who is a veteran would still require more than simply a CCW to avoid the issues mentioned before. And the cost, timing etc. of that training raises the same questions as before.


quote:

ORIGINAL: papassion


we have military men and women, who were teachers, returning from active duty who have served in combat situations, thus have more training and practical real world shooting experience than most civilian police officers. And we say they aren't "qualified" to handle a gun and defend a school?



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RE: Anotther school shooting. - 12/24/2013 3:11:51 PM   
MalcolmNathaniel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: papassion


we have military men and women, who were teachers, returning from active duty who have served in combat situations, thus have more training and practical real world shooting experience than most civilian police officers. And we say they aren't "qualified" to handle a gun and defend a school?


A soldier and a policeman have very different types of training. Just because they both have professions that involve firearms does not mean that it's the same job.

I hunt deer. That involves firearms. If I wasn't wearing blaze orange you would never see me until I want to be seen. That doesn't make me qualified to be a cop. Being a cop doesn't qualify someone to be a teacher.

The whole thing is insane. If you go and actually look at history you'll find that school shootings are not something new. They aren't even increasing in number or danger. They have simply been more talked about in the media. You can find the data yourself. It's easily available. I'm not putting a link because you might find the source reputable. Just look for the raw data and you'll find it.

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RE: Anotther school shooting. - 12/24/2013 3:15:49 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		FR

I was talking to a member of a local school board recently, and the question of police mistaking armed school personnel for the shooter came up. I was told they do have a protocol in place with law enforcement that would allow the "good guy" to be immediately identifiable by their appearance. For pretty obvious reasons, they don't disclose what it is.

I have no idea how widespread the practice might be, but it makes damn good sense.

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RE: Anotther school shooting. - 1/2/2014 10:32:11 AM   
EdBowie


Posts: 875
Joined: 8/11/2013
Status: offline 		http://news.yahoo.com/spike-in-mass-shootings-creates-demand-for-different-police-approach-132625638.html

Interesting overview of the current situation.

quote:

According to a study obtained by Yahoo News, rampages like the Washington Navy Yard and Los Angeles airport shootings have tripled in recent years.

The report, written by the Advanced Law Enforcement Rapid Response Training (ALERRT) Center at Texas State University, will be published next week in the “FBI Law Enforcement Bulletin,” a training publication for criminal justice professionals.


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Profile   Post #: 545
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