quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

This might sound really really disgusting, but have you considered medical leeches?

I treated the severe arthritis of my dog with it (it's an approved method for human arthritis) and after seeing how pain free she was, thought "Why not try it on my back?"

Can't do it on your own, it's fiddly and yeah, takes some getting used to, but it helps a lot for backpain, I had shots before (which worried me as they contain morphine), quite good results with acupuncture but that never lasted very long. I regularly fly long distances (UK to the West Coast of the US), so that's 18 hours flight and ages lugging luggage through airports, etc. I usually have the leeches applied 2 days before I fly (to give it a chance to scab up, wouldn't want to freak out the nice people at the border) and I'm pain free to bearable pain for something between 3 to 5 months. I had a few accidents with injuries to the spine, and did a lot of things in my misspent use that aren't really fantastic for disks, hence a few herniated ones.

You really do need medical leeches for it, not just jumping into any leech infested swamp, that are bred under almost sterile conditions and have never ever fed on anybody else, as that would be very risky.

You can't use it if you're on blood thinners or have clotting problems, so definitely check that with your doctor before. If the idea doesn't gross you out completely, you might find that it gives you great pain relief.

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ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

LC,

As much pain as I'm in daily, just thinking about leeches starts a panic attack!

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

Why do you think that the pain clinic Doc shouldn't be practicing?

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

The pain clinic doc was the surgeon?

You had your back surgery done by a non-neuro surgeon?
Pray tell, why on earth would you choose to do that?
Was he even board certified?


And did you have him explain the CT scan prior to surgery?
What did he say at the time that justified the surgery?
(And why did your insurance company allow it?)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Well, the obvious question is, why are you still on pain if the surgery ws in September? Something's wrong.

This isn't exactly what you want, but a flogging (NOT on the back!) might ease things for a bit.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

LC,

As much pain as I'm in daily, just thinking about leeches starts a panic attack!

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

LC,

As much pain as I'm in daily, just thinking about leeches starts a panic attack!

It's a bit gross, but to be honest, I am getting more freaked out by morphine shots and possible addiction than having leeches on my back, where I don't even see them, my other half is oddly fascinated by them, I watched them when we treated my dog. Took me a while to come round to them, but back pain from previous spinal injuries and herniated disks can be crippling, if you're regularly doing long distance flights in cramped airplane seats, it makes the situation worse, I was first the same with "Ewww, no way" but after over a week not getting much sleep, waking up after a light snooze because the pain was like somebody jabbing knives into my spine, I just went "Yeah gross, but I honestly will try anything, I can't sit, stand, lay down, I haven't had a decent night's sleep in days, being still hurts, moving hurts..."

By now I have named the leeches and I'm so freaking grateful to them, I can't stand the idea of having them killed, if they're reused on the same person again, there is no risk of infection, so Vampy, Vlad, Dracul and the rest feed regularly on me (I need them about every 4 to 6 months, they are ready to feed about every 6 to 9 months), I am pain free and can move. Doggie girl has her own leeches and is arthritis free.

Seriously, if it comes down to horrendous pain, morphine and possible addiction and being a bit grossed out, I take grossed out and a normal life. I can't tell you how grateful I am for the little bloodsuckers, I even admire the odd patterns they have on their backs now. If you would have asked me before I read all the research, I also might have gone into panic attack mode. Let me put it this way, having a root canal done is pretty scary and freaks people out, unless they have an infected root canal and just want the pain to stop....

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

LC,

As much pain as I'm in daily, just thinking about leeches starts a panic attack!

It's a bit gross, but to be honest, I am getting more freaked out by morphine shots and possible addiction than having leeches on my back, where I don't even see them, my other half is oddly fascinated by them, I watched them when we treated my dog. Took me a while to come round to them, but back pain from previous spinal injuries and herniated disks can be crippling, if you're regularly doing long distance flights in cramped airplane seats, it makes the situation worse, I was first the same with "Ewww, no way" but after over a week not getting much sleep, waking up after a light snooze because the pain was like somebody jabbing knives into my spine, I just went "Yeah gross, but I honestly will try anything, I can't sit, stand, lay down, I haven't had a decent night's sleep in days, being still hurts, moving hurts..."

By now I have named the leeches and I'm so freaking grateful to them, I can't stand the idea of having them killed, if they're reused on the same person again, there is no risk of infection, so Vampy, Vlad, Dracul and the rest feed regularly on me (I need them about every 4 to 6 months, they are ready to feed about every 6 to 9 months), I am pain free and can move. Doggie girl has her own leeches and is arthritis free.

Seriously, if it comes down to horrendous pain, morphine and possible addiction and being a bit grossed out, I take grossed out and a normal life. I can't tell you how grateful I am for the little bloodsuckers, I even admire the odd patterns they have on their backs now. If you would have asked me before I read all the research, I also might have gone into panic attack mode. Let me put it this way, having a root canal done is pretty scary and freaks people out, unless they have an infected root canal and just want the pain to stop....

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ORIGINAL: dollparts85

How long do they live?

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ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

quote:

ORIGINAL: dollparts85

How long do they live?

You lose some because they overeat (literally) and those aren't always the largest one, basically once they fall off (which they do by themselves when they are full) you put them into a jar with filtered water, the first 10 days you change the water regularly, britta filtered water or spring water works fine, as the first 10 days they metabolize like crazy and what they can't digest gets released into the water. A big jar like a gerkin jar works fine (cleaned of course and thoroughly rinsed as they are super sensitive to chemical residue and chlorine in the water) and some cheese cloth on top of it, secured with a rubber band as they like to crawl about and tend to get through even small air holes (but do need oxygen). We have some from when we treated the doggies arthritis first, which is now 4 or 5 years ago (we make sure to label them so they are only used for the same animal or human, so nobody can be contaminated) and they seem to be fine. I really don't know how long they can actually live, never googled that, and they're not quite like pets that are affectionate, they seem to like my blood and I like that they give me a risk free pain killer.

If you do have a physican that is open to alternative treatment, talk to him about risk assessment, especially if you have clotting problems, and if you order the leeches, order them from a reputable firm where they are grown and raised in as sterile an environment as possible. I was bothering the company with a bunch of questions, like what the feed on before they are send out and stuff, and they told me that they get blood from an abattoir that is checked out by a vet and a human blood specialist for anything pathologic and they get it via a special feeding device that mimics an organism, which is one of the major expenses in raising them, I rather pay about $10 for one and have that security than pay half of it and get all sorts of nasties, though I doubt that any breeder would be stupid enough to run that risk, I still prefer to rely on the breeders who also supply hospitals and are checked out by them, I'm a bit paranoid that way.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I could order them directly but they told me to speak to my vet (when I ordered them for doggie) and much later when I said I want to use them, they suggested that I speak to my GP first, regarding blood thinners, allergies, etc. I did and since I had nothing that would speak against it, I signed a form that I was told to speak to my GP and got them sent. The first application was actually made by my Chinese acupuncturist, who wasn't at all surprised and told me that they have used them for centuries, he never brought it up because he thought I would have the typical Western reaction of "EEEEK, how horrible and medieval"

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ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

LC,

I'm in constant pain, but the anxiety attack isn't worth it. I tried acupuncture, but had to make her stop because I had an anxiety attack.

I've had shots in my back. They didn't help, but I know they didn't have morphine in them either.

Dollparts,

So you got back surgery, something very serious without even thinking about a second opinion and now blame the doctor? Neurosurgeons are not the only ones qualifed for spinal surgery. Orthopedic surgeons can be and there are also surgeons who only do spinal surgery.

Regardless, blaming the doctor for your back troubles is kind of ridiculous unless you take responsibility for the fact that you didn't do your homework on the issue with questions and a second opinion.