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ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

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Thank you for making my point exceeding well for me.

You have just established that europeans are not the same as americans. Fuzzy theists are not the same as fundamentals.

You, for whatever reasons you choose, choose to lump fundamentalist christians into the same camp as fundamentalist muslims. Thats your right - to characterize people as you wish. So the question becomes, Now, why won't you accept that OTHER people find there are differences between muslims and christians.

Why do you so vehemently argue there is not? When you engage in the exact same behavior, just with different target groups. Why is "your way" ..""correct"

Because of the results, rather than the hypopthesized results. People, for the most part, don't 'live by the Koran' or 'live by the Bible'. What they *actually* live by is whatever it takes for them to keep themselves prosperous enough to keep going, without incurring enemies who want to harm them and, in fact, keeping on civil-enough terms with the people around them. It's very, very ordinary, for most people, the world over.

It doesn't matter what's in the Koran and what it indicates about what people should believe nor how they should act. Mr Ali who sells me my daily newspaper clearly has no interest in jihads; he doesn't care about women covering up all or part of their bodies. Feck, he even sells soft porn mags on his top shelf. Bottom line: I am *very* confident that he doesn't want to kill me. He just wants to sell me newspapers, and keep himself in business. He wants a quiet life, in which he's able to live comfortably enough, without getting into fights with people. Most people, the world over, are like Mr Ali, regardless of whatever creed they happen to claim to buy into.

There are people like me, and Mr Ali, who sells me newspapers, and the fundamentalists, the fruitcakes and the fuckwits. One group is decent and I can get on with them; the other is not. I have no interest in defending the group who is not. They add nothing to humanity; all they ever do is fuck it up that bit more. If you want to side with the American branch of fucker-uppers, Phydeaux, that's your option - but you're not 'one of us', you're 'one of them'. What else can I say?

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Well, you're right in that there really isn't much else to say.

Britain, for most of its existence, was built by people and principles much closer to my side of the aisle then yours - a contribution and a heritage you deny. Your view of the other is fundamentally dehumanizing

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


Here's what I had said:

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Since we were talking about germany, lets try to stay consistent.

I asked you what facts do you have to dispute:

1. Native population is declining.
2. Muslim birthrates, even though they grow closer to native - never get less than 3 children - more than double native german rates.
3. immigration is increasing muslim population 1% a year.
4. On top of all these thngs - significant numbers of convrsions occur - the rate of conversion away from Islam is 1/10 the rate of conversion TO islam.

The fact is - there has never been a pattern such as muslim immigration in the west - it is a new paradigm one not easily described by other immigration patterns.

Here's what you said:

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It isnt even hearsay, its racist bullshit. As is Hahns notion that there are 20 million migrants waiting to enter the EU. Lets not forget the 20 million figure comes from a member of a conservative party from Eastern Europe.

As are most of Phydeauxs posts, such as accepting Hahns claim at face value, when only 1,300,000 asylum seekers entered Europe last year, many Christian and many from Africa.

Since you say that my posts are bollucks, and racist bullshit, I chose to further support my claim #3. I could have picked any of them. They are all equally factual.
For example - your disputation of the figure of 20 million is ridiculous.

Turkey has 2.5 million refugees. Jordan has more than 1.6 million. Lebanon has 1.5 million - in all more than 6.5 million syrians. 2 million arghanis, 1 million somalians, a million libyans. A million Iraqi's. Half a million Pakistanis.

Add in Yemenis, eritreans, tunisians, egyptian. Albanians. Hell - Greeks are migrating out of their country. And this is only people already left. Others will leave if conditions in Europe improve; when winter is over, or if things on the ground in their home country get worse.

But I digress. You're the one that represented my figures were total bollucks. Except that you are in fact conceeding that my figure was correct, and thereby that muslim immigation did infact increase the muslim % in germany by 1% and is poised to do so again. Just like I said.

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ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

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There is A huge difference in our thinking and wiring.

The 'our' in that line isn't one that I subscribe to, Cinnamongirl. Perhaps you should have said 'some of our' thinking. If you mean 'Christians' as 'us' and Muslims as 'them' ... then I've obviously failed to convey to you one of the basic points in my last post, because the categories of 'Christians' versus 'Muslims' aren't useful, to me, for describing fundamental things around me that either I want or don't want.