quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

I have a question for those who see doing some bottoming, apprenticing, or anything short of springing out fully formed ( I love that!) is bad/weak/wrong/whatever.

What is it  you feel you would lose if you did? 

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

.... a 53 year old man who views submission in terms of weakness and humilitation.

Since this is absolutely not my belief at all, and you won't find it posted *anywhere* under my name, I hafta conclude that once more you're projecting your own confused thought processes onto me.  G'won, tell me how you weren't referring to me; it's just a remorseless barrage of blanks from you, ay?  lol
 
Focus.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
Much mighty DOMINANT that I *obviously* am, I don't own the company where I work nor am I even the manager!  <gasp>  But my Dom hard-wiring still plays a role because it IS who I am.  The boss man tells me what order he wants particular jobs done but he does not presume to tell me how to do them.  And when we do have a difference of opinion, rest assured I'm not one to just stand there all head-bowed and dumb-struck "taking my medicine" just because he's tha boss.
 
In the outside world, being a Dom tends to manifest itself slightly differently to my relationships in that I will NOT be dominated, disrespected or talked down to in general.  If that means "creating a scene", even one that may cause embarrassment or violence, so be it.... 
 

quote:


Archer, what you're not entirely grasping is that for many of us, "swallowing pride" or "trade(ing) service for information" is just too high a price for ANY information. 

quote:

But I do think that apprenticing and switching are two separate concepts/paths towards learning, while you (Michael) seem to be lumping them together.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Wildfleurs,

quote:

But I do think that apprenticing and switching are two separate concepts/paths towards learning, while you (Michael) seem to be lumping them together.

I agree they are different but they all have one thing in common, there are people here who believe one or more of them less than the best way to become a better/real/whatever dominant and I was hoping for responses from any of those people.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

quote:

ORIGINAL: BossyShoeBitch

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Damn.

A knock out drag out fight and I wasn't in the middle of it. Must have been that scene I did last night as a bottom where I learned a lot about myself as well as some good stuff for mindfucks.

Damn. I still can't believe I missed last night Michael!

Poor Focus.  How very sad for narrowminded (or is it closed minded? I never can get those terms straight) old folks like him.  They never can see the forest for the trees can they?

Last and least - the fight groupie..... *yawn*
 
I can't be bothered looking but you've already responded to the topic, right?  I mean this isn't just some lame-duck drive-by post where you barrack from the bleachers like some vaccuous loudmouth at a sporting event?
 
Go you!
 
Focus.

quote:

Damn, I still can't believe I missed last night Michael!

quote:

   Is it possible I could be a "better" hetero if I'd sought out a gay experience, for eg? 

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

I have a question for those who see doing some bottoming, apprenticing, or anything short of springing out fully formed ( I love that!) is bad/weak/wrong/whatever.

What is it  you feel you would lose if you did? 

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grlwithboy

Leatherfolk, Alyson Publications. While you may be content to D/s however you like as an island, some people don't.

quote:

One doesn't HAVE to participate in the public scene, but consistently calling some of its well-established protocols "moronic" isn't going to go over smoothly with people who do hold that subculture dear.

quote:

It may not be your cup of beverage, but whether it is or not you may find it an interesting piece of history dating back to mid-century and prior, and you might want to consider that a lot of people consider themselves heir to this kind of dynamic who post here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
Much mighty DOMINANT that I *obviously* am, I don't own the company where I work nor am I even the manager!  <gasp>  But my Dom hard-wiring still plays a role because it IS who I am.  The boss man tells me what order he wants particular jobs done but he does not presume to tell me how to do them.  And when we do have a difference of opinion, rest assured I'm not one to just stand there all head-bowed and dumb-struck "taking my medicine" just because he's tha boss.
 
In the outside world, being a Dom tends to manifest itself slightly differently to my relationships in that I will NOT be dominated, disrespected or talked down to in general.  If that means "creating a scene", even one that may cause embarrassment or violence, so be it....  
 

The problem with having a black and white, up is down, left is right rationale to people is the fact that the opposite of black HAS to be white, the opposite of up HAS to be down, and the opposite of left HAS to be right.

By attributing a strong will and a desire to fight back when disrespected to your "Dominant hard wiring" and not your individual personality, then you are, in fact, auatomatically attributing the opposite of that to the "Submissive hard wiring". Hence, logically, you are saying that submissives are weak willed, "stand there dumbstruck and take their medicine", and allow people to walk all over them, because these are the opposites of what define your "Dominant hard wiring".

So you are, in fact, saying submissives are weak willed and doormats, because to have the opposite of your "Dominant hard wiring" and therefore be a submissive, they will have do the exact opposite of the things you have attributed to that "Dominant hard wiring".

I guess people with "switch hard wiring" only fight back some of the time.

quote:


Archer, what you're not entirely grasping is that for many of us, "swallowing pride" or "trade(ing) service for information" is just too high a price for ANY information. 

quote:

Your saying that by submitting or being in service, it would, in fact, come at a cost of your pride and therefore is humilating. By saying you have to "swallow your pride", you are saying that it is beneath you and lower than you.

Perhaps you will attribute this to your "Dominant hardwiring".

How does that work exactly when helping to deal with the insecurities of a submissive regarding their submission?

"Well, babe, its only an insult to pride and humilating when I do it, not when you do it."

Or perhaps...

"Look, I was born with my uber strong willed dominant hard wiring and you were born with your weak willed submissive hard wiring. We all cant be winners so you gotta just deal with it."

This is the "getting past" I was "preaching" about and the lesson that is inherent in the experience of being of service to a dominant.

Godforbid, dominants try and view submission as something virtous and respecting and not as the derogatory "pride swallowing siege" you keep depicting it as when it comes to you doing it.

Your fond of "homosexual and heterosexual" analogies in reference to this. Perhaps you will argue that you view being submissive as low and humilating because of your dominant orientation just like you view sucking cock as disgusting because of your heterosexual hardwiring.

However, the flaw in this is that being a heterosexual excludes you from a relationship with a homosexual and being dominant includes you in a relationship with a submissive.

So eseentially equating submitting with pride swallowing is the same as saying "God, I hate taking it in the ass! I wont swallow my pride to do it and be the little bitch in the relationship! Thank God, I got my faggot lover who likes to do it for me. If thats his preference, whatever. At least I dont have to play the catcher and I certainly dont envy him for doing it"

Such derogatory views on what your intimate partner does for you in the relationship...

quote:

ORIGINAL: BossyShoeBitch

Well, since you did quote my post:

quote:

Damn, I still can't believe I missed last night Michael!

and incorrectly assumed I was referring to your rant with MadRabbit, I'd like to clear up any misunderstanding. I was referring to being upset I missed seeing Michael the night before.  Surely narcissism hasn't become part of the psyche of  the
"Much mighty DOMINANT that (you) *obviously* a(re),"

And as far as being a "vaccuous loudmouth" as you so eloquently put it, if that is your perception of me, then you are by all means entitled to your opinion.

Interestingly enough, I too am entitled to state my opinion. 

You stated time and time in this thread that you are hardwired as a Dominant and have no need to submit, bottom or serve. You have no need to walk a mile in your submissive's shoes because you don't care to learn what the view is from their perspective. You run the show period.  That's great.  That is your choice and it is a valid choice. 
However, it is when you hear of another Dom's equally valid choice to experience things from a submissive's perspective and you belittle that choice because you don't understand it ...

quote:

How sad, intolerant, closed minded and just plain ignorant of you to mock another's choices and dare to attempt to label them according to your own, shortsided views.  People like you deserve the darkness of your existence by spending your entire, unhappy lives in the same dark, inflexible, square box of your own construction.

quote:

There's a whole bunch of us folks out there whose D/s does not revolve around community, public play, sharing slaves and the notion of "learning" to be dominant through submission. 

quote:

  just as submitting, for eg, is NOT normal behaviour for a Dominant - IMO.