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Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 10:20:37 PM

MzMia

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What is too young to be a submissive?
I wonder about men in their 40's/50's/60's taking up with these tender young
women in their early 20's.
They are so young and impressionable, especially if they are only 18.
Would you want your daughter 19, moving in and becoming a slave to a man of 50?
Let's hear it.

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RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 10:34:13 PM

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i can tell you i have 3 daugters and i would be very angry and think these men would be taking advantage of young impresionable women wheather they were of age or not im not sure any of them under 25 really know what they want and i know some will say well older has more knowledge thats crap under 25 is just taking advantage just my opinion

(in reply to MzMia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 10:41:08 PM

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I have always been a submissive. I'd have saved myself a lot of pain and anquish if, at the age of 22, I had become owned rather than gotten married to the man I did. Had I been directed early in life (I was in search of that and without knowing I was "a submissive" I ended up with domineering bullies), I'd have been a lot happier.

Edited to clarify - the dominant's intention is everything here. I would agree that to solely acquire a cute young trophy sub can be dangerous. I didn't intend to negate your concern with my post.

< Message edited by ownedgirlie -- 6/23/2007 10:47:36 PM >

(in reply to MzMia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 11:23:45 PM

obis

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*shrug* When I was 19 I had a relationship with a woman who was in her late 40s. I had another in my early 20s. Of course I was young and impressionable, that's why I sought out people who could teach me things -- so that they could make an impression!

Sometimes the fun of a relationship is in helping someone grow, and in doing so reminding yourself what is exciting that you may have begun to take for granted in your own life. Sometimes the fun is in being with someone who already knows what they're doing and isn't fumbling around as much as you are.

The notion that young women are in some way a special class of people who shouldn't be given the opportunity to learn or experience what they like seems strange to me. Most women under 25 who I know laugh at older men trying to hit on them -- obviously the ones who don't are finding something personally appealing about the situation.

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 11:29:48 PM

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A good dominant, regardless of the age difference, should nurture their submissives. I don't have children, but if I did (particularly a daughter) I would have a hard time accepting she has grown up. That's the real issue here. I would need to sit back, and say "Yes, I see you're a woman now, and I need to respect your freedoms. I'll always love you, have fun and be safe."

It would be my daughter's choice to choose a right dominant. It is my choice to acknowledge her as an adult or not. I probably never will, and any man I see her with will always inspire "If you harm my little girl..."

As for a Master-slave relationship, it would be harder to watch. I don't want my daughter to feel like she has to please others. Only if that is the means for her to please herself. It's incredibly hard for a father to know that your daughter has chosen a man to please.... And if said man tells her to please his friends, that she would. It would be gutwrenching to see my daughter cry from another man's hands.

In short... Daughters never grow up in the eyes of Daddy.

_____________________________

The Loving Owner of HisHeavan

... You've waited your whole life for this moment...

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RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 11:41:24 PM

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Very well put I couldn't have said that any better myself.
It's never easy to let them grow up & even harder if they choose this paticular way of life .
But facts are facts they do & it's just something we have to learn to live & deal with.
I do know the thought & feeling for my daughter is 21 thinking she's 30 & this kind of life is her choice not mine to make.They have to grow & learn just as we have.

(in reply to HeavansKeeper)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 11:41:38 PM

damia

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In my mind, age doesn't matter; experience does. Yes, taking a 19 year-old woman who knows nothing or very little about the lifestyle, and automatically moving her into a 24/7 relationship...that is not right.

But if a 23 year-old woman has 5 years experience in the lifestyle (meaning she began learning about and in the lifestyle when she was 18), and she knows what she's getting into...what's the harm? Some women have a preference for older guys.

Just some thoughts,
Jewel

(in reply to MzMia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 11:48:49 PM

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As a 23 year old I guess I can chip in a little bit. I've dated guys up to 12 years my senior. My parents, while not being 100% ok with it, have always said they trusted me judgement and put information in my head about what they think, but they don't force it on me. Granted, they don't know that they've been my Doms as well as my boyfriends but I guess that's a different story...

I also have to say that anyone of any age jumping in to a 24/7 would be something to worry me. Even if/when I have years and years of experience, I wouldn't jump into a 24/7 until I knew the other person really well....

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The lifestyle comes to each differently... always remember that....

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RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/23/2007 11:51:20 PM

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My opinion, as a 24yr old submissive, is that I should think that a father would worry more about how his daughter was being treated than how old the man was (regardless of whether it is a bdsm relationship or not.) I have always been dated older guys (around 15yrs older usually, with the exception of my exhubby, who was my own age.) For some young girls, they simply do not get along with the immature guys of their own age bracket.

When I brought my last dominant home to meet my dad, I was initially worried. My dad is actually my stepdad and was the same age as my dominant...I was afraid he would find it uncomfortable...when I asked him about it, he just said, "What matters is that he is good to you and he makes you happy...age is just a number." That tends to be my take on it too.

Overall, I think the young sub/older dom is the best approach. As a young sub myself (exploring/researching at age 18, got seriously involved at age 20), I know that I feel much safer in the hands of an older man. I worry much more about young girls taking up with 25yr old "so called dominants" who really don't know a thing about what they're doing yet. You're much more likely to get hurt physically or emotionally that way.

Yes, young girls are tender and impressionable. I was married at 18, divorced at 19, involved in BDSM at age 20. I'm just so glad that my young, inexperienced, and impressionable mind had a loving older dominant there to guide me safely through my inital learning process.

< Message edited by GeekyGirl -- 6/23/2007 11:53:16 PM >

_____________________________

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(in reply to damia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 12:06:22 AM

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Actually, I think those older men of 50ish have just as much trouble in picking someone who is at a ripe, green age. If someone is honest, there's no harm done and I hardly care if someone older wants to be with someone younger. However, the inexperienced, unwise, and probably lazy and foolish bring with them their own burdens to the old and seasoned. I say they get what they deserve, which is a compromise one direction or another. The young, and the old alike have their benefits and their drawbacks.

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(in reply to GeekyGirl)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 2:35:40 AM

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The problem with a very young woman/older man combo in BDSM is that very young women tend to come equipped with families who take an active interest in their lives. Such families tend to worry about the age factor in general, but add the element of BDSM and it's a recipe for disaster. They cannot believe that their precious child could possibly have developed this "perversion" all on their own. They look for someone to blame. And bingo! The older man is the villain of the piece. Any older Dominant playing with a very young woman puts himself at severe risk. Even riskier - she tells you she is 18 - but how old is she really? 17? 16? Dynamite!

Of course it can work. But anyone who thinks it isn't risky is very naive, given the nature of the society in which we live.

If it's an older woman/younger man combo, the social double standard is more likely to result in sniggering or "good on yer mate!" but is less likely to land you in the law courts, shrug.

:))
LH

< Message edited by LadyHeart -- 6/24/2007 2:37:25 AM >

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RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 4:00:43 AM

imthatacheyouhav

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

What is too young to be a submissive?
Not sure about that, i suppose age if you are of legal age its fine

I wonder about men in their 40's/50's/60's taking up with these tender young
women in their early 20's.
They are so young and impressionable, especially if they are only 18.
Would you want your daughter 19, moving in and becoming a slave to a man of 50?
NO!! i would not.

Let's hear it.

_____________________________

*if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything*
**collared July 22 2007 by LordKen**

(in reply to MzMia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 4:25:08 AM

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MzMia, thank you for posting quite a thought provoking question.

When I first read this, all the usual and negative thoughts came to mind as the pictures of my 3 (adult) female UM’s flashed through my head. But I realized that some of that negativity did not apply, so I gave this some thought prior to posting. I have noticed that 2 out of the three show submissive tendencies, the other would be best identifying as a Domme. Of the two who I feel are submissive by nature one is 19, the other 25.

Keeping in mind that every Dom is different and depending on their life talents I can not say that an older Dom would be wrong, especially for the older one. I do not believe there is a magic age or a cut off where age is concerned as long as the Dominant was equipped with the knowledge and patience to direct her while bringing out the best in her. Finding the right one would actually be no different then it is for myself.

The other …. She’s a bit switchy but I believe it’s caused by self protection. She has not lived a lot of life yet, but the life she has lived she has shown the ability to be self disciplined and excel. Although often I notice that she searches for a safe spot that a well disciplined Dominant could easily fill. Age in her case would matter, only because she has trust issues with older men. I’ve often wished someone like MadRabbit would appear in her life. Someone like him I think would fit the bill perfectly.

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RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 5:19:45 AM

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i was raised a Lutheran which i've always considered "Catholic Lite - 60% fewer guilts than your regular Catholic" but i continue to hold the belief that all 'sin' is in the motives not the acts themselves. 50 year old man with an 18 year old girl... what is the motive? sex with a niave young hard-body? to find someone young enough to still believe the lies? OR to be with someone they can nurture, protect and cherish, not as easily found in cynical, bitter or emotionally jaded older females? What is the motive? That's the key to in regardless of age or any other factor.

_____________________________

Proudly owned by InkedMaster. He is the one i obey, serve, honor and love.

No one is honored for what they've received. Honor is the reward for what has been given.

(in reply to MzMia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 5:41:07 AM

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My answer is in two parts that link together.

Part One - No, I don't see anything wrong with it. If older men are looking for trophy submissives, wives or girlfriends ... they are no different than younger men that are looking to tag the same thing. Older men are vastly more interresting, in general.

Part Two - I have no idea why so many people my age are in such a hurry to form lasting relationships. Most of us will probably live to be ninty ... what's the hurry. Even if you meet the person of your dreams ... can't they still be the person of your dreams while just dating? If not, are they really the person of your dreams?

(in reply to MzMia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 6:19:59 AM

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quote:

The problem with a very young woman/older man combo in BDSM is that very young women tend to come equipped with families who take an active interest in their lives

Well I can say with certainty that if I was 40, my mother would be 60 and STILL taking an active interest in my life....age doesn't change that (especially since I will be living at home until they die, helping them run this farm.)

quote:

Such families tend to worry about the age factor in general, but add the element of BDSM and it's a recipe for disaster.

My mother married outside the norm with my stepfather..by marrying a man several years younger than she is. Age factors have never bothered either one of them.

quote:

They cannot believe that their precious child could possibly have developed this "perversion" all on their own.

No, they know I came by it the honest way...genetically! She might not be a sub (more like is domme in the bedroom, if I took my guess) but I know they're freaks! We've had many conversations about it, and while I'm definately more "hardcore" than she is, she's the one who told me about proper toy use and good safey precautions for using handcuffs. She knows I'm a freak...and to a lesser extent so does my dad, so he tends to tell me that he doesn't need to hear the details. He's fine with me saying, "Well you know I have unique romantic interests." "Yes, dear that's fine...save the details for your mother."

quote:

Any older Dominant playing with a very young woman puts himself at severe risk.

With a woman over 18, what risk is that?

quote:

Even riskier - she tells you she is 18 - but how old is she really? 17? 16? Dynamite!

I would assume that in today's day and age, any intelligent man, bdsm or vanilla, age 18 or 80, would be smart enough to ask for an ID before he became involved with someone who might possibly be a minor.

Not trying to pick on you...just making the point that you are making a sweeping generatlization about modern young women. Many of us were raised by liberated modern women who are just as freaky as we are...a lot of them don't care if we're kinky and they don't care if we date older guys.

My parents actually prefer the older men, as they have good jobs, are settled, more interesting, and because they know I've always been precocious for my age, so I get along better with them.

They also know I'm stuck in "perpetual kid" mode and that I will never grow up....therefore, they understand my desire for a dom who's a "daddy figure" and think it's a good idea. To quote Mom, "God knows you need someone wise and mature to take care of you after we're gone...because you'll probably never be capable of taking care of yourself."

_____________________________

"It's nothing that I understand, but when in your arms you have complete power over me. So be gentle if you please, 'cause your hands are in my hair, but my heart is in your teeth and it makes me want to make you near me always."

(in reply to caitlyn)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 6:20:05 AM

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I think a lot of it is just plain old physical attraction. I say this based on about 6 or 7 years of following the personal ads, in both vanilla and adult-oriented sites. My views here are about what I've observed as a "woman looking for a man". I can't speak about what goes on inside the women's heads, except my own.....

Let's be honest....a lot of people, both men and women, past 40 (and any numbers I use here are purely arbitrary and are rounded off for convenience) have (and I HATE this phrase, but it's used a lot) "let themselves go". Many of the men my own age, which is 49, to me, look OLD. I am just not physically attracted to a guy who looks like my father, or even my grandfather....in my own mind! I know that's MY problem, which is why I can relate to what I think the men go through. I don't like it, but I accept it :)

A lot of men start playing the field after a divorce. Their self-esteem is down, they haven't been in the dating scene for 20 or more years and they see women their own age, who to them, look OLD. It's a big reality check. They aren't attracted to those chubby women with short hair. They're in a bit of a mid-life crisis, haven't really accepted the fact that THEY themselves are that old, too, that they themselves are chubby and have NO hair, lol. So, they start looking at what they are attracted to: those ten years or more younger than they are. I have seen many men in the ads who list their ages as 40-something, and it's obvious by their photos that they aren't a day under 60. Or, they post a great-looking photo of themselves as the primary photo, but then you see this much older-looking photo, the "real" one, further back in with the rest of the photos, the ones with the fancy car and the dog. :)

There are a lot of men who list their age as mid-to-late 40's and list their ideal woman as "28 to 40". I have encountered men who say they are 47 or 48, but when I contact them, they reject me because I am "too old" for them. And I actually look a lot younger than I really am....people meeting me (other women, lol) constantly say they thought I was about 38 or 39. But, I get a ton of profile views and "winks" from men in their late 50's and 60's.

Anyway, don't mean to ramble on.....in a nutshell, I think it just boils down to physical attraction and ego.

_____________________________

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RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 6:33:37 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

What is too young to be a submissive?

Where I live, seventeen. Beyond that, there is no absolute. A young woman is old enough when she's old enough.

quote:

I wonder about men in their 40's/50's/60's taking up with these tender young women in their early 20's.

There isn't much of a mystery there. We're still savages, we just like to pretend that we aren't now. Sometimes our "rational" mind is actually in charge, but most of the time it's just along for the ride, providing a running critique. The attractiveness of young women to men of any age is pretty much hard-wired. It's not going to go away, the only question is how well, or poorly, we deal with it. One of the ways that society has tried to deal with it is to make it a social taboo. That only works to the extent that the men (and young women) in question care about social taboos. The audience to which you posed your question probably cares less than the population at large.

quote:

They are so young and impressionable, especially if they are only 18.

My experience has been that a woman having her first experience of slavery is no less impressionable at 38. A first impressions hit hard, regardless of age. A young woman of 18 is most certainly impressionable. The quality and character of her master, or boyfriend for that matter, regardless of his age, will probably shape those impressions more than how old he is.

quote:

Would you want your daughter 19, moving in and becoming a slave to a man of 50?

As opposed to, what? Being pregnant by another 19 year old who is now nowhere to be found? Yeah, probably.

It would depend a lot on the man of 50 that we're talking about. He might have the life experience, emotional maturity, and time honed skill at keeping a slave girl that would genuinely aid in her maturation process. He may also be no more qualified in that regard than the typical boy her age. At 19, a young woman is usually gathering experiences that shape the woman that she ultimately becomes. My wish for my daughter would be that those experiences enrich, rather than impoverish, her view of herself and how she relates to men. I wish the same for any 19 year olds out there wrestling with the same choices.

I would probably be far more concerned if she was calling the 50 year old her boyfriend, or fiancee, than her master. The former kinds of relationships imply a relation of equals, which requires more in the way of common interests and compatibility.

< Message edited by Leonidas -- 6/24/2007 6:34:30 AM >

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RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 6:40:38 AM

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If a person is emotionally ready for a "vanilla" relationship of a particular degree of commitment, he or she is ready for a kinky relationship of that degree. In other words, if you can have a fuckbuddy, you can have a periodic playmate. If you can cohabit, you can have a residential d/s relationship. This, naturally, is a decision that the person in question makes. Others only need to decide whether they are willing to have relationships with him or her.

Some people are emotionally ready for certain kinds of relationships at eighteen, others at thirty, others simply aren't wired for those kinds of relationships ever.

As for being young and impressionable: receiving impressions isn't necessarily a bad thing. This is why young people, say, go to college, or look for mentors in professional fields, or join subcultures that strike them as a appealing. Likely, they'll receive good impressions and bad ones, and as they develop intellectually and emotionally, they'll learn to evaluate them morally, ethically, and according to their own taste and preference. As for the possibility of emotional harm.yes, people are likely to experience emotional hurt in their first serious relationship. I think this is part of having relationships, and perhaps even part of growing up.

(in reply to MzMia)

RE: Is she too young for you? - 6/24/2007 6:42:17 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leonidas

The attractiveness of young women to men of any age is pretty much hard-wired. It's not going to go away, the only question is how well, or poorly, we deal with it.

Just yesterday i received an email from some 19 year old submissive who asked me "At your age are men still interested in you?"

i guess she gets it that men are hard-wired to be attracted to youth

_____________________________

Proudly owned by InkedMaster. He is the one i obey, serve, honor and love.

No one is honored for what they've received. Honor is the reward for what has been given.

(in reply to Leonidas)

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