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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 10:00:08 AM   
MystressDream


Posts: 345
Joined: 7/11/2004
From: Colorado
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SlavishStudent

I'm so happy to see this thread!  I know, how horrible of me, but it's nice seeing both sides get judged by their age; personally I'm getting rather fed up of being mailed by those who are 50+ telling me that's what I need, being young and relatively inexperienced... I'd welcome emails from people more my age, but they never seem to come:(


Just keep at it, the right person is bound to come along, age regardless!



Since this response was directed at me, I will answer briefly.  In no way did my post slam anyone for their age.  I even stated how I delight in interacting with the young Doms in my life.  I also stated the "I am Dom hear me roar" mentality is NOT age related.  Older new Doms/Dommes are just as guilty of it.  I don't believe it is age related, but, maturity is a huge factor.  If you are one to scoff at advice from someone with experience, then I wish you luck.  Be careful out there.

_____________________________

Knowledge and experience are wonderful things to share. When we stop asking questions, we might as well "hang it up".

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(in reply to SlavishStudent)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 10:14:19 AM   
SlavishStudent


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Oh I'm sorry MystressDream, as you can see, it was like my 4th post or something... someone doesn't know the right buttons to press!  I was just pressing whatever brought up a type box!

(in reply to MystressDream)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 10:55:04 AM   
MystressDream


Posts: 345
Joined: 7/11/2004
From: Colorado
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SlavishStudent

Oh I'm sorry MystressDream, as you can see, it was like my 4th post or something... someone doesn't know the right buttons to press!  I was just pressing whatever brought up a type box!


Ok... understood.  Thank you.  <smile>

_____________________________

Knowledge and experience are wonderful things to share. When we stop asking questions, we might as well "hang it up".

check out: www.enclaveproductions.com
www.enclavewest.com

(in reply to SlavishStudent)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 11:47:46 AM   
LadyHugs


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Dear Guilty1974, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
I agree with a lot with what you have stated in your post [Reference Post #36].
 
I think a lot of problems come from making assumptions as well as not being open minded and or 'humble' enough to listen to those who might be wise and or experienced in areas that older Dominants might not be well educated, experienced and or familiar with.  But, again -- respect goes both ways and a lot of problems come with attitudes and behaviors which takes on the appearances of one dominant trying to out dominate another.  Like two roosters fighting a cock fight to impress the ladies and or audience.  I've watched this happen more than I care to count.  This happens with dominant females--so there is no exclusion with this 'out doing' as to focus attention and attract slaves/subs/mates.
 
That said, sometimes how a young Dominant handles an older Dominant will affect how things go on from the point of disagreement and or doubt.  I recall my brother-in-law who is a dentist, saying how many fellow dentists quit going to medical conventions, learn new techniques and tinker with new products.  He does go every chance he can get as, he puts it--his patience deserve everything that works to their advantage and their dental health.  This has been the attitude of my father and mine as well.  Learning ends when you are dead, buried--even dead, an opportunity to teach someone still exist as the probe your carcass. 
 
It is very difficult for new, insecure and or entrenched mindsets to be corrected.  Having this in mind, a change of speech as to not shake ego and or their 'stature' is how attitude and behavior can change a person -- regardless of age and or time in the lifestyle.  It is this form of diplomacy, tact and or 'grace' if you will which invites people to learn from younger Dominants.  This is something that those young Dominants often 'miss' and or 'scoff' at--but, until they experience it themselves and or use a bit of kindness in responding to counter the advice--then both parties loose.  This is what is sad to see.
 
That said, Guilty1974; you have to me a lot of experience with rope, its torque load and weight bearing load and the things associated with load angle and or straight rope bearing loads and the lot, as far as suspension goes.  Sometimes, presenting foundation to your opinion really gives others that 'light bulb' moment or the "Ah and Ohs" reaction.  Again, you have content and guts that create the knowledge to come to your opinion.  This earns respect.  I am sure you know how laundering rope can weaken it and or chemicals change man-made fiber as well.
I'm also sure, that clever creative applications are thought of as to have a barrier between the rope of suspension and the suspended person's skin; such as wrapping vet wrap/bandage around the skin touching areas as to act as a barrier and not compromise the rope, etc.
 
As you well stated; sometimes one has to associate with like minded individuals no matter what age they may be and or what mileage they have in the scene and or lifestyle.
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to Guilty1974)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 12:00:17 PM   
MadRabbit


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Well, I guess the people who are just interested in enjoying the company of other people, learning skills that they simply want to learn for their own enjoyment, and enjoying new experiences and activities as they are presented with a layed back, casual, non-seriousness attitude as opposed to viewing being a "Dominant" as some community standard, divine title, or career deserving of a special honorific on par with being a doctor or judge are completely screwed.

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(in reply to LadyHugs)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 12:23:38 PM   
LadyHugs


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Dear SlavishStudent, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
Congratulations on your postings so far--its a bit nerve fraying in the beginning but, as with anything experiences teach you. 
 
I enjoy working with young Dominants myself.  I think I grow a few years younger around young adults--must be because they remind me of myself and how all the hands up older Dominants gave me in my quest to be a good Master.
 
In the system that I was involved with and learned in, the oldest and most senior Dominant taught and gave more rapid successes to things, due to not learning bad habits and having to relearn new habits.  How to correct things before they became disasters and tricks of the trade if you will.  Lessons these Dominants learned.  But, from that system we were empty vessels.  Every Dominant had a lot of information, knowledge, skills and the like they poured into my empty vessel.  It was 'their' knowledge they gave to me--passing the torch to a new generation.
But, what I did with other's knowledge is the key here --taking what you learn and using it and making it your own is the most important point I can stress.  I'm a very intense teacher.  I often overwhelm people with information. But, I have a lot to share and I'm more willing to part with my knowledge, skills and my lessons of life.  I am investing in people when I teach.  Just as those who taught me--invested in me.  The attitude of those days was, what was taught might not be used for another 15 years down the road.  However, it will be there when/if you need it.  It will be a memory.  Many Dominants and many ways of doing the same exact thing; gives so many ways to problem solve something, such as a whip technique.  When something works for you --you're a success.  Much like making a car out of many different people's parts--you'll have created the car which speaks of you --the person, an individualized dominant person.
 
There are young and old Dominants who either gasps this or they don't and have to slug their way to success due to attitude and or behavior. 
 
I personally get really excited when I have young Dominants who haven't handled a whip or cane and tinker with techniques that work best for them and instant success and accurate strokes and can hit a match stick with a single tail, while a thick rope is swinging like an old pendulum clock swinging back and forth, to have timing down as well as aim.  The happiness, the high...the giddy responses--priceless.  They leave with more than what they came in with.
Or, when I translate what they see and observe and change how they react and from a tense slave to a relaxed and near floating slave in service.  Learning the art of observation and elevation.
 
That said, not all seasoned Dominants are good teachers.  Some not so skilled or knowledged Dominants are excellent teachers.  And, there are every mixture in between.
 
In taking a student Dominant on, rather new to the group.  He asked why those Dominants wouldn't teach him anything.  My observation was that what they knew was limited themselves.  People only grow in skills and knowledged from those in their enviorment.  I was fresh from the outside and had more time in applying my art and mastery.  So, it was easy for me to surpass those there and still have much more held close to the vest.  I think I have only shared 1/10 of what I really know and or my experience -- ever; even when teaching for an academy like group.  So, within a short time, in teaching this excluded Dominant what I knew and how to; he suddenly became 'mr. popular Dominant.' 
 
My style of teaching isn't from a 'lecture' approach, although I do presentations and demonstrations however, when I am in a teacher-student role, mentoring role-- I really ask the students more how they come to their views, observations, perceptions and such.  Then I carefully and purposefully ask for their consideration on whatever we're working on.  I do want people to find how they operate and how they come to their role.  Changes come from within a person -- I cannot change people through force.  But, I have seen through the years if people have foundation, the guts -- such as roots, history association, practice, own evidence and research, application and tests to confirm to be true; to the solid knowledge they have, they stand on their own with their first hand knowledge and skillls--others will listen, as what is said--no matter if its from a child prodigy to a wise old man of 1001; will resonate and change of mind, heart and attitude/behavior will occur.
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

< Message edited by LadyHugs -- 12/27/2007 12:26:04 PM >

(in reply to SlavishStudent)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 12:44:04 PM   
LadyHugs


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Dear MadRabbit, Ladies and Gentlemen,
 
Not necessarily -- just as long the 'intentions' are known and not deceive someone as to where they are lead into something which they didn't bargain for.  People should know where they stand with partners and or relationships, regardless if it is a 1 hour scene and or 100 year relationship and everything in between.
 
Nothing has been said that fun is excluded.  Nothing has been excluding casual interactions and or a informal interaction either however, no matter the interactions--responsibilities are always necessary to understand and the lines to stay within; so that everybody can have a positive time and positive memories.  Nobody should have to suffer regrets, doubts and low esteem.
But, without communication from one partner to another; example a Dominant laying out the plan, the immediate and or future; the partner, such as the submissive/slave then can take the information given and make a choice.  It is not fair for someone to not have enough information to make intelligent choices and just trust someone on their self entitlement.

 
Calling yourself a Master when all what is promised turns out just to be 'sexual intercourse buddies' and no meat/substances to what is claimed, being in 'the lifestyle'--that is where I have interest with.  I don't mind individuals who put up front they want casual play and or relationships.  Its being honest.
 
Those who 'rant' and 'rage' about not getting respect and or getting 'lucky'--because they cannot give an answer as to where their intentions are, goals for the relationship and or how they come to their conclusions, opinions and or their facts --then use an excuse that they are being picked on for this or that...such as age, race, gender, styles or such when someone asks--then get nasty or condensending because an older and or seasoned Dominant asks questions and goes in depth often yields answers with nothing needed to add.
 
How can there be communication when no sense of where a person is going and or coming from is expressed.  It is easy to make a statement -- I am a Dominant.  But, beyond that--where are the answers of 'why, when, how they are 'a' Dominant.  Why would a slave want them as 'a' Dominant.  There is no correct or wrong answer--but, silence isn't an answer at all.
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs
 
 

< Message edited by LadyHugs -- 12/27/2007 12:58:17 PM >

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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 12:59:53 PM   
Cyis75


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From: Georgia
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It's always been my opinion that age is just a number and by no means a representation of anything by itself. Just as a person is made of up the sum of all their parts. You have to consider all the information to be able to make anything resembling a clear picture. I got active publically in my mid-20s and sought out and surrounded myself with those twice my age to learn from. I'd already gone through several hard lessons in life and managed to come out relatively unscathed so maybe I wasn't the typical 20something male dominant.

Now in my early 30s I do see quite a bit that makes me chuckle and it's not always the younger ones. It is more about how they project themselves through the means by which they have available. I don't tend to put a lot of the things I've learned out publically in profiles or posts as I think some lessons have to be learned and they are things that those that get to know me will find out on their own.

As others have already stated you have to know who you are first and be in control of yourself before you can ever be in control of another. That also fits on the opposite foot I believe as a good submissive should be in control of him/herself before they can truly give it over to another. As I believe someone else mentioned earlier, and I'm sorry I can't recall off-hand to properly attribute, respect is not something that is demanded but rather earned. It is also a two-way street in my opinion as just because someone submits to you does not mean you shouldn't respect them any less than what you would want them to respect you.

The most succent way I can think of putting my thoughts is that regardless of age, just because you claim to be dominant doesn't make you one. Your actions, the respect of those who know you and the respect and trust of those that choose to submit to you are what make you dominant. As a dominant you have no power over someone until they choose to give you that power over them.

(in reply to LadyHugs)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 1:07:07 PM   
LadyHugs


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Dear Cyis75,
 
Well said.
 
I'll also add, that I can give respect out but, I cannot expect respect in return.  I also don't demand it or command it.
 
It takes an awful lot to make me reconsider giving respect to someone.  I like to think I have a very deep well to draw from, when it comes to respecting others.  I also know I will not please everyone and will never have 'their' respect.  But, at times --it really isn't necessary to sway such individuals--as there is no respect in their hearts to begin with.
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to Cyis75)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 2:56:48 PM   
digitalsky


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From: San Diego
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I agree wholeheartedly with everyone in this discussion who has said that respect is earned, not taken. But it brings up an interesting question: Can someone submit to the will of another (for the purposes of teaching, and to learn what things are like on the other side of the whip) and still identify as a dominant?

While I agree that proclaiming yourself a dominant doesn't make you one, the fact remains, that is the attitude that feels most naturally to someone. As such, it might be difficult to put yourself in a situation where you bend to anothers will. Tact notwithstanding, if your options are limited, and what you have seen so far is unsatisfactory, where do you turn to for guidance? More specifically, a guidance that leaves you fundamentally intact?

(in reply to Cyis75)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 3:02:17 PM   
Cyis75


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From: Georgia
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LadyHugs,

I agree with you that one can't expect respect just because they can give it, they can only hope that their actions and how they treat those around them will find them worthy of respect. I've told several that have addressed me with honorifics that I did not require nor expect it. One prime example is a wonderful switch lady I've known for many years who as a dominant I admit could put me to shame, but regardless she continues to this day to refer to me as Sir.

I find I tend to give a measure of respect until proven wrong, once proven wrong it is always much harder to regain any amount of respect. Kinda like trying to improve your credit score after you screw it up. I try to see the best in those around me, but unfortunately that's often a pipe dream but doesn't mean I should change who I am because of how others are.

Regards,
Jeremy

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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 3:16:57 PM   
anowner


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From: Little Rock, AR
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MystressDream says, "Looking for groups who are in your age group is NOT a good idea." I disagree, partly. It's not a good idea to limit oneself to groups like that, but I see nothing wrong and much right in having such a group as part of your experience.

(in reply to vampchick88)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 3:20:06 PM   
MystressDream


Posts: 345
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From: Colorado
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quote:

ORIGINAL: anowner

MystressDream says, "Looking for groups who are in your age group is NOT a good idea." I disagree, partly. It's not a good idea to limit oneself to groups like that, but I see nothing wrong and much right in having such a group as part of your experience.


"Part of" yes.  Entirely, no.  The poster had said he wasn't comfortable associating with the older crowd, and so wanted to find groups his own age.  I took that to mean he wanted to just focus there.  If I was wrong, I admit it freely.

_____________________________

Knowledge and experience are wonderful things to share. When we stop asking questions, we might as well "hang it up".

check out: www.enclaveproductions.com
www.enclavewest.com

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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 3:29:13 PM   
LadyHugs


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Dear digitalsky, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
I feel strongly that if/should a Dominant 'bottom' as to experience the feel, sensations, the exchange of power, to see from a submissive posture as to gain some respect, appreciation and understanding as to become a better person as well as a better Dominant--I would be honored to TOP a Dominant respectfully and such a way that they are not in the views of other Dominants, slaves, subs and the like--and or, the 'peanut gallery.' 
 
My soul desire is not to deminish or tear down --its only to enlighten and or open someone to consider other ways of experiencing and or seeing things.
 
My preferences would have such an experience in total privacy and what happens stays between the two of us.
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs
 
 

(in reply to digitalsky)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 3:48:30 PM   
anowner


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Digital Sky asks, "Can someone submit to the will of another (for the purposes of teaching, and to learn what things are like on the other side of the whip) and still identify as a dominant?" I'd say yes, depending, of course, on the someone.

(in reply to anowner)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 3:56:08 PM   
LadyHugs


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Dear digitalsky, Ladies and Gentlemen;

I wanted to take this section separately to respond to.

You wrote:
While I agree that proclaiming yourself a dominant doesn't make you one, the fact remains, that is the attitude that feels most naturally to someone. As such, it might be difficult to put yourself in a situation where you bend to anothers will. Tact notwithstanding, if your options are limited, and what you have seen so far is unsatisfactory, where do you turn to for guidance? More specifically, a guidance that leaves you fundamentally intact?

  
 
Dominants are much more than an 'attitude' in my opinion.  Yes, there is an attitude however what is done with it is important as to slice it onto the side of being a supportive, positive and guiding role within the attitude OR, will it be sliced into a domineering, controlling, negative and or surpressing role.  Dominants assume an authority role--its only an authority of a slave/submissive/bottom 'allows' and or consents. But, as its been discussed before--Being Dominant does not mean being Dominant to everybody/everyone.  There has to be that 'sense' or 'knowing' what and or who is the correct Dominant for you.  Of course, people will have their observations and comments however people have to choose who they empower with the role and responsibilities, expectations and everything associated commonly with what a Dominant is/may/would/can be.  I also feel attitude gives way through experience and time; to be replaced by 'presence.'  An air about someone that isn't attitude based alone or tossing titles about--but something a bit more.
 
As difficult as it may be in a Dominant role to imagine 'yielding' and or 'submitting' to another--there will be times compromises will be made and at times appear as being submissive.  These times I think is when a Dominant can be yielding and or submitting themselves for a higher cause than mere appearances but, out of being human and or humble enough to step down or aside for the betterment of himself/herself and or the relationship and or skills, knowledge, application and such.  If I am faced with a Dominant who is an authority on an area, I will yield.  It is out of respect as well as allowing an authority on an area to have the platform of being out of a peer level into a teaching/mentoring/educational level.  This doesn't mean I am less of a Dominant.  I just know how to empower others so they can maintain their status as to be my teacher/mentor/educator/guide.  It is that little unknown power exchange between Dominants and a lot of times, the desire for self improvement and learning more than when we started and or refreshing our knowledge/skills/education.
 
As far as reaching to other Dominants to elevate your Domination in many different ways, while keeping you fundamentally Dominant; one can look into attending training academies such as Butchman's and or Master Taino's Training Academy for "Masters."  One can look into attending Master-slave conferences, where workshops are held and attended by many individuals in many stages of their own journey.  This is also an option for slaves as well; as to attend academies and or Master-slave conferences.  The focus isn't so much on the S&M but, the journey of becoming a Master/slave and how to work in relationships with your partner (be it slave or Master); and this also applies to Dominants and submissives.  It causes one to be 'real' with themselves.  Old or new to it all--you leave with more than you entered with.
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs    

(in reply to digitalsky)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 4:05:24 PM   
ForcefuIHands


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-eating Dom-In-A-Box fortune cookies-
"MEISSODOMALLTHETIMEZ = Most Dominant Name Evar"

Sorry, I only do the long ranty post as a young Dominant once a week, going into the respect and responsibility diatribe. Besides, LadyHugs has the forums covered. She is the OP, and without sarcasm, you should rise when she posts, because the thread is over folks. There's no following that; it's like Sinatra.

TheScrivener did a decent job though. I clapped a little, seeing my work had been done. -tear-

(in reply to anowner)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 4:41:15 PM   
chellekitty


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FR to mini-rant on quantity vs. quality of "years of experience"

yes, by mere virtue of existance, a Dominant can only have 10 years of experience at and after the age of 28 (assuming they began engaging in BDSM at the age of 18, which we will for the sake of legality)...but if those 10 years are spent futily, with little ability/no interest in furthering their education and just ocassionally engaging in kinky behavior, though my assesment may be harsh - the quantity has little quality...

and though i am not saying this is the standard, but typically a younger Dominant is not tied down with things such as children and/or a job that takes up all their time, even when they are home (professional/degreed jobs are famous for this) and therefore, should they choose to, they have the time to devote towards furthering their education in the lifestyle, both mentally and physically...and certainly older Dominants do this as well...but when it comes down to it those things we look at as benifits to being with an older Dominant can hold them back in their personal journey when it comes down to the nitty gritty of setting priorities in daily life...and all that to say...3 to 5 years of experience, without all of those other priorities to set before this lifestyle, can have a lot higher quality...

take care
chelle


_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to ForcefuIHands)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 4:45:30 PM   
DarkDaddyZ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

FR to mini-rant on quantity vs. quality of "years of experience"

yes, by mere virtue of existance, a Dominant can only have 10 years of experience at and after the age of 28 (assuming they began engaging in BDSM at the age of 18, which we will for the sake of legality)...but if those 10 years are spent futily, with little ability/no interest in furthering their education and just ocassionally engaging in kinky behavior, though my assesment may be harsh - the quantity has little quality...

and though i am not saying this is the standard, but typically a younger Dominant is not tied down with things such as children and/or a job that takes up all their time, even when they are home (professional/degreed jobs are famous for this) and therefore, should they choose to, they have the time to devote towards furthering their education in the lifestyle, both mentally and physically...and certainly older Dominants do this as well...but when it comes down to it those things we look at as benifits to being with an older Dominant can hold them back in their personal journey when it comes down to the nitty gritty of setting priorities in daily life...and all that to say...3 to 5 years of experience, without all of those other priorities to set before this lifestyle, can have a lot higher quality...

take care
chelle


I agree with what you said.  For 5 years, I did three things in S&M Play, flogging, spanking, and cropping. I trolled to get off and have fun in public and private.  I didn't gain MUCH power exchange experience at that time and I probably didn't care if years later, that I'd learn other kinks.

Z-

_____________________________

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(in reply to chellekitty)
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RE: young Dom/Masters with sub/slaves - 12/27/2007 6:08:01 PM   
PsyVamp


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheScrivener

Being an aspiring Dominant isn't particularly easy. ...

Master yourself, take charge of your life, and present yourself in the right manner.  If you do that, odds are you'll have pleasing results.



Exactly
*claps slowly*

Each and every dominant was new and inexperienced at some point, the world would  be a very uninteresting place if only us "older dominants" existed.
You have been given some wonderful advice though, and I hope you take it to heart.

Be a master of yourself, be able to take care of yourself fully.  Know yourself, your likes and dislikes, know your limits and never stop learning.  Always remember that there are things to be learned from everyone, younger-older sub or dom.  Let your action follow your words and you'll have a better chance of doing well. 
I was a teen when I had my first "submissive" although, "back in the day" he and I didn't have labels.

Good luck!

Lady Jag



_____________________________

Don't take life too seriously; No one gets out alive. .
Could a blue screen of death constitute being defenestrated?
~Owner of wolf~ (one of them, anyway)

(in reply to TheScrivener)
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