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RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:28:58 PM

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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Pop - I have no doubt your papers are in order. I was making the point that close to all of the people on these boards come from elsewhere. We're nearly all immigrants, or descendents of. I doubt very much that all of our ancestors were completely clear with regards to their immigration papers.

It's an incredible shame how readily people will crush the most vulnerable just to make themselves feel better. It's always somebody else's fault, isn't it?

Kittensol, when the Irish, Polish, Germans, Italians and other groups came over a hundred years ago they went through places like *Ellis Island* so they certainly did have their "documents."
All the Irish and Italian people I knew growing up and their parents were here legally. They had to be because they came by ship and had to go through a "legal port of entry." They had to go through Customs and Immigration.
My grandmother told us stories of how people whould be crying when they were turned away for being sick or diseased. And she said they put them right on the next ship bound for Ireland. No ifs ands or buts.
As for "crushing the most vulnerable" that woman is not one of "our" vulnerable, she's one of Mexico's vulnerable.
And it is someone's fault, it's her fault for breaking our laws!
They never have the money for a lawyer do they?
Oh! Here's an idea, why didn't she go back to Mexico and "apply" for U.S. Citizenship legally?

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to kittinSol)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:30:38 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: satyrne07

Here's the way it used to work... You first had to make it to an immigration center like Ellis Island. Then you had to PROVE you could write your name or say one sentence in ENGLISH. Then NO ONE was allowed in unless they had $10 cash American money. Only if you could pass all those tests were you allowed to enter the country legally.

You know, I once heard of a country (can't recall which one so at this point its hearsay) but in order to become a legal citizen of said country, you would have to possess or in some way be able to convince them that you were going to be an asset to the country.....something about you having to show you had a skill they needed...like more doctors or something.

If we were to have something similar, you KNOW we'd be called the most racist country on earth. Just think of the line at that facility

Clerk: "What skills do you possess?"

Immigrant: "I can clean houses."

Clerk: "We have TONS of cleaners already, sorry. Next"

(in reply to satyrne07)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:33:21 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

Kitten...are you afraid that you'll lose your cleaning lady?

:-) I can't afford one.

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RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:37:58 PM

Posts: 1505
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Santa Rosa
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: satyrne07

Here's the way it used to work... You first had to make it to an immigration center like Ellis Island. Then you had to PROVE you could write your name or say one sentence in ENGLISH. Then NO ONE was allowed in unless they had $10 cash American money. Only if you could pass all those tests were you allowed to enter the country legally.

You know, I once heard of a country (can't recall which one so at this point its hearsay) but in order to become a legal citizen of said country, you would have to possess or in some way be able to convince them that you were going to be an asset to the country.....something about you having to show you had a skill they needed...like more doctors or something.

If we were to have something similar, you KNOW we'd be called the most racist country on earth. Just think of the line at that facility

Clerk: "What skills do you possess?"

Immigrant: "I can clean houses."

Clerk: "We have TONS of cleaners already, sorry. Next"

THAT WOULD BE MEXICO

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Zeedaddys
~DJ domahpet~
*Love is giving someone the power to break your heart, but trusting them not to*

*crystal*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLI12uN6k5k

(in reply to Smith117)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:41:03 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: domahpet

THAT WOULD BE MEXICO

If that's true, then it makes my point all the better. Why should it be easier for them to get into this country than it is for someone to get into theirs?

(in reply to domahpet)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:42:08 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

My great-grand parents were full-blooded german and came here and made lives for their familes, many of whom enlisted in the US military and fought against their parents' former countrymen.

What an incredibly ridiculous thing to say.

Care to elaborate? Or don't you feel that doing things the legally is the right thing to do?

It's just that it seems silly to be so proud of your ancestry when you participated nothing towards it :-).

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RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:42:54 PM

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Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Santa Rosa
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maybe theyre smarter

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Zeedaddys
~DJ domahpet~
*Love is giving someone the power to break your heart, but trusting them not to*

*crystal*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLI12uN6k5k

(in reply to Smith117)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:43:11 PM

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You know, with the state of the US economy, I can foresee that many of your countryfolks will soon be leaving this country like rats fleeing a ship: where do you think they should go?

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RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:47:27 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

It's just that it seems silly to be so proud of your ancestry when you participated nothing towards it :-).

Where did you see the word "proud" in my statement? I simply related what they did and how they didn't sneak into this country illegally. Besides, I believe can express pride in my great-grand parents' actions without having a hand in it the same way parents can express pride in their children or any other facet of their lives.

Your comment is like saying "how can you be proud of your home when you didn't build it?"

I didn't make my ancestors do what they did, but I can be proud of them for it. Same as I can be proud of our service members today for the sacrifices they make (though in this instance, I actually am one of them).

(in reply to kittinSol)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:47:58 PM

Aylee

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Joined: 10/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

It's just that it seems silly to be so proud of your ancestry when you participated nothing towards it :-).

WOW!

Now there is an intolerant statement.

You have just ridiculed ALL of the people who participate in ancestor worship.

My oh MY!

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I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to kittinSol)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:48:34 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: domahpet

maybe theyre smarter

Clearly not, or their country wouldn't be hemmoraging people looking for "better lives."

(in reply to domahpet)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 3:59:18 PM

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From: New Hampshire
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KittenSol, I'm more angry at our government for not doing it's job and enforcing our laws.
Anyone who works for the govt and doesn't want to do their job needs to resign or be fired.
This woman should have been caught and deported long ago.
She should have done the right thing years ago and she wouldn't be in this position.
I don't know how people like that think.
*They're in a foreign country* but they don't want to obey our country's laws but when they get caught it's never, "their fault."
Before I got Irish citizenship if I had stayed in Ireland longer than 90 days and the Garda caught me I'd have been arrested and put on a plane back to Boston.
No "hearing" no nothing.
That would have looked good on my passport; "Deported from Ireland."
I guess the laws only apply to us law abiding people.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to kittinSol)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:01:23 PM

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Joined: 5/14/2007
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Popeye i ask this sincerely, not to start an argument......what would have been the "right thing" she could have done years ago?

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it aint no good til it hurts just a little bit....jimmy somerville

in those moments of solitude, does everyone sometimes think they are insane? or is it just me?

(in reply to popeye1250)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:05:06 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SeeksOnlyOne

Popeye i ask this sincerely, not to start an argument......what would have been the "right thing" she could have done years ago?

I would wager she could have done a few things. Apply for citizenship for one, return to mexico for another...keep her legs shut if she didn't believe or couldn't afford birth control, or any combination of the three.

A law-abiding "citizen" who learns they are, by virtue of circumstance 'outside' the law, should seek to abide by said law as soon as possible. She did not.

(in reply to SeeksOnlyOne)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:08:30 PM

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From: New Hampshire
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Seeks, gone back to her home country and applied for a visa.
Look at all the people who are here now, Immigrants from other countries who waited *years* to get here doing things the *legal* way.
But, some people just figure that they're too good for that I guess.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to SeeksOnlyOne)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:09:50 PM

Posts: 1505
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Santa Rosa
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

[I believe can express pride in my great-grand parents' actions without having a hand in it the same way parents can express pride in their children or any other facet of their lives.

good one, ive heard the before,
whered you get it? very original...
http://www.collarchat.com/m_1730373/mpage_3/tm.htm

_____________________________

Zeedaddys
~DJ domahpet~
*Love is giving someone the power to break your heart, but trusting them not to*

*crystal*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLI12uN6k5k

(in reply to Smith117)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:13:09 PM

Posts: 2012
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: SeeksOnlyOne

Popeye i ask this sincerely, not to start an argument......what would have been the "right thing" she could have done years ago?

I would wager she could have done a few things. Apply for citizenship for one, return to mexico for another...keep her legs shut if she didn't believe or couldn't afford birth control, or any combination of the three.

A law-abiding "citizen" who learns they are, by virtue of circumstance 'outside' the law, should seek to abide by said law as soon as possible. She did not.

wow-but all the other legal citizens who suck mightily from the govt tit-thats ok with you huh?

these people are CONTENT with nothing. it is all they have ever had-they find strength in family. they do not collect a welfare check and wear designer clothes. they can make 5 meals out of what most folks would use in one. they will live in a one bedroom apt and sleep head to toe in one bed to have a roof that they manage to pay for with their meager earnings.

illegal aliens piss me off too, but i see them doing more good for the community, with their work ethic, than i see the many legal citizens who choose to do nothing but figure out new ways to sit at home and do nothing.

i dont have the solution, but screaming what someone could have done, when they had no skills to do it-im sure thats not the answer.

and without some great minds deciding this will not go away on its own, and coming up with a solution, were fucking doomed in so many ways.

_____________________________

it aint no good til it hurts just a little bit....jimmy somerville

in those moments of solitude, does everyone sometimes think they are insane? or is it just me?

(in reply to Smith117)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:14:03 PM

Posts: 1447
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: domahpet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

[I believe can express pride in my great-grand parents' actions without having a hand in it the same way parents can express pride in their children or any other facet of their lives.

good one, ive heard the before,
whered you get it? very original...
http://www.collarchat.com/m_1730373/mpage_3/tm.htm

I've seen that thread but I didn't read past the first two or three posts.

As for where I "got" what I typed....it came out of my head just as fast as my fingers could hit they keys.

(in reply to domahpet)

RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:15:08 PM

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Joined: 2/25/2008
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I find this entire letter misses the point; however, I agree personal responsibility is sorely lacking with regard to the mother.

At what point was it a good idea to have eight children while illegally in a foreign country and barely able to support them?

Her personal decisions reek of idiocy; while perhaps my view of the world is somewhat cutthroat (in the same way that perhaps the ocean is a bit damp), this is for the best. The children will be better off with role models who exhibit more stable behavior and more personal responsibility, and the mother is getting what she deserved for her idiotic behavior.

As to the question of illegal aliens itself, that is complicated to say the least... I don't wish to spark an all-encompassing debate, so I will simply state that our system as currently constituted encourages this kind of total fucking nonsense.

From a factual basis - the kids are US citizens, and should be treated as such. Which means placed in foster care, given an opportunity to attend schools, and then given a chance to be functioning members of society. If one does not like this turn of fate, look into changing the laws determining who is a citizen; you cannot punish the kids further (than having a totally batshit mother to begin with and growing up in poverty) by changing the rules post hoc.

Last, to those commenting on abusing the weak and helpless, explain to me how leaving eight children in a subsistence level home, with a clearly irresponsible mother who cannot care for them, and thus almost certainly dooming them to a life of poverty and neglect, is the humane thing to do? The humane thing is to deport the mother, give the children to foster families, and let them learn the lesson that life is a cold, harsh thing. Let them learn that your own dumb fucking decisions often have a major impact on others, and that others can cause great harm to you in the same way. Perhaps they will learn the lessons their mother did not.

Harsh? Perhaps, but I don't claim to be an overly nice person.

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RE: those damn illegals - 3/27/2008 4:16:01 PM

Posts: 2012
Joined: 5/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Seeks, gone back to her home country and applied for a visa.
Look at all the people who are here now, Immigrants from other countries who waited *years* to get here doing things the *legal* way.
But, some people just figure that they're too good for that I guess.

i dont think she has ever thought her self too good for anything. what you say sounds good, but when should she have gone back to a country where she knew no one. at 18?

16?

21?

it sounds perfectly sane to me in some ways, but totally unrealistic when you look at the choices (or lack there of ) that she has had in her life.

thanks for the reply

_____________________________

it aint no good til it hurts just a little bit....jimmy somerville

in those moments of solitude, does everyone sometimes think they are insane? or is it just me?

(in reply to popeye1250)

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