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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/18/2010 9:07:59 AM

PeonForHer

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I reckon one of my bearhugs would stop you, Lady Hib. I'd give it a damned good try, anyway.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/18/2010 9:12:04 AM

LadyHibiscus

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Most excellent!!

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/18/2010 9:13:54 AM

Missokyst

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Yikes.. I think I love you.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/18/2010 9:17:08 PM

DommeKeliDallas

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quote:

ORIGINAL: chicagosubsteve

i'm new to collar me but, more importantly, have only seriously been exploring by needs to submit for a strong demanding woman for just over a year. my profile sets out my first attempt here to describe what i'm looking for and i have posted a journal entry that shares my feelings after a recent session wtih a Pro Domme. the overall context is that this is all happening within the context of what i generally consider to be a happy marriage. over the course of years i've tried to raise the issue of wanting to be spanked, or have toys used on me but she has zippo interest. to date i've been able to get my needs met with Pro Domme services (escort or Lifestyle) but am hoping for a more consistent relationship with someOne seeking a part-time but regular sub for service and more. i welcome any feedback, input, suggestions and comments You have to offer. thank You very much.

humbly in service,

chicagosubsteve

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If you go to a Pro Domme, that is your business.
If it is not sexual and she is helping you get something you CRAVE...get it on...
but KNOW that karma may bite you in the ass.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/19/2010 4:31:53 AM

MissAsylum

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DKD- i disagree. Karma WILL bite him in the ass. its a matter of time. if you have no consent from the wife, you are in fact CHEATING. seeing a Pro Domme is giving you physical and emotional fulfillment, both of which is supposed to be done by the wife.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/21/2010 5:55:52 AM

slavekal

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A married guy looking to get his sexual needs met in a long term outside relationship is a man who is not being fair to anyone. You can't eat your cake and still have it. Single dommes do not want a relationship with a married man. You are not going to be around on holidays. You are not going to bring them to family events and such. If you want to cheat on your wife, you are going to have to pay pros.
And I am not saying this bit to beat you up, but why do men constantly marry women who do not share their sexual desires? It is a recipe for disaster.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/21/2010 7:30:21 AM

LadyHibiscus

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The piece that genuinely baffles me, Kal, is that so many men CLAIM they "did not know" those desires when they married.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/21/2010 8:24:34 AM

Andalusite

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I think that's possible, especially if they are older and weren't aware of S/M or D/s before they married. I've had relationships with 4 people who had never tried D/s or BDSM before, or only did a little light spanking or biting, but who had fantasised about it or hadn't really thought about it until I brought it up. Heck, I was actively engaged in BDSM for about 10 years, 5 of them as a bottom, before I realised it was possible for me to be submissive. I was rather adamantly opposed to the idea until then. Peoples' interests can change over time. I still don't think that it's a good excuse for cheating, but a lot of people don't really know what they want until they try it, or may want different things from different people.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/21/2010 1:22:25 PM

DesFIP

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

DKD- i disagree. Karma WILL bite him in the ass. its a matter of time. if you have no consent from the wife, you are in fact CHEATING. seeing a Pro Domme is giving you physical and emotional fulfillment, both of which is supposed to be done by the wife.

You are presuming that the marriage is still emotionally viable. That's one hell of an assumption. I know a lot of people, especially in this economy, who can't afford to divorce and have their children be unscathed. If the marriage is dead, and they are more roommates than anything else but with a lot of bitterness between them, then there is no chance there will be either emotional or physical fulfillment by the spouse.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/21/2010 2:43:30 PM

LadyHibiscus

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Anda, I guess I will accept that "people growing apart" argument, but "discovering" kink late in life? I am willing to be that those guys who Just Never Knew were wanking to Emma Peel pics, and dreaming of their strict teachers.

Celeste, I am amazed and appalled at how many deeply unhappy marriages there are. I have never been married, so I can only marvel at the disaster folks have brought on themselves---and be really sad for the children of those that decided to BREED on top of it. I don't blame those folks for staying together so the kids can have some level of school/home stablility. I DO blame them for sneaking around, cheating, and doing all manner of hurtful and deceptive things using their previous bad judgement as an excuse. Those kids GROW UP. The parents should, too.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/21/2010 4:35:07 PM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Anda, I guess I will accept that "people growing apart" argument, but "discovering" kink late in life? I am willing to be that those guys who Just Never Knew were wanking to Emma Peel pics, and dreaming of their strict teachers.

It's not that a person 'just never knew', Lady Hib. It's more that a submale is quite clear that he has those feelings, but doesn't think they'll ever become reality. Femdoms don't exist. I do know women who've always wanted to dominate but didn't know that submales existed until they were in their late thirties, either.

I didn't believe that femdoms existed till I came here, to CM, a couple of years ago. All of my three brothers and two sisters are married - I could have been married myself, by now. Then . . . the Internet kicks off . . . CM starts . . . I discover it . . . What would I do, had I got married to a vanilla (actually, more of a femsub), when it was clear to me I could have done a few years ago?

Added to that is a clear separation that I think is common in malesubs. This is that there are women, and there are cold, superior, unfeeling Goddesses. You get married to the first; you never really have a relationship at all with the second. That sort of malesub - assuming he's married, but - like me - has recently discovered femdoms - is very likely to think a) Great, I'll go get a femdom, but b) I love my wife, she's a real woman, not a cold Goddess and I don't want to lose her, and also c) my wife won't understand that a Goddess and a wife aren't in competition with one another for my affections because I have entirely different feelings about both, so d) I'll keep it quiet from her that I'm looking for a femdom.

The few femdoms I've spoken to who've discovered their dominant nature late haven't been like that at all, though. What they've had in common is vanilla relationships that have driven them to utter fury and led to them breaking up with their vanilla spouses. But, then, there has been a powerful, very vocal force behind such decisions to dump husbands that feel oppressive to those sorts of women - feminism.

Where's the equivalent force that supports men who want to be submissive to women? Of course, it's next to non-existent. The occasional nod from feminist thinkers - but, let's face it, feminists aren't there for men and, in any case, most of them found their theories on the assumption that everyone wants more power, not less. Feminists in general have made a pretty pisspoor job of supporting submissive men. In general they don't believe in them and don't trust them. Submissive men don't fit into their world-view.

Nope, it's bad for a would-be malesub to bullshit his wife and go off to find a femdom on the quiet, but I'm not inclined to damn such a man instantly to hell. As I said, 'there but for the grace of God go I'.

< Message edited by PeonForHer -- 6/21/2010 5:07:50 PM >

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/21/2010 4:48:45 PM

sweetsub1957

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~FR~
i just will never understand why someone free & single on either side of the kneel would want to be with a married partner w/ previous obligations who they can't ever be seen in public with & who will never be around for holidays, birthdays, times when you need your s/o really bad for whatever reason. And above all, someone married who isn't honest with his/her spouse, so how can they be trusted to be honest with their bdsm partner either? And i don't always buy that "We just drifted so far apart" jazz. Maybe they did, but if it's that bad, why are they still married? If it's for the kids, hey, kids know when their parents are miserable and, being kids, will probably blame it on themselves. Is that fair to the kids? i'm just trying to figure it out and, still, i just don't "get it."
~sweetsub~

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 10:20:53 AM

LadyPact

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer
It's more that a submale is quite clear that he has those feelings, but doesn't think they'll ever become reality. Femdoms don't exist.

I didn't believe that femdoms existed till I came here, to CM, a couple of years ago. Then . . . the Internet kicks off . . . CM starts . . . I discover it . . . What would I do, had I got married to a vanilla (actually, more of a femsub), when it was clear to me I could have done a few years ago?

a) Great, I'll go get a femdom, but b) I love my wife, she's a real woman, not a cold Goddess and I don't want to lose her, and also c) my wife won't understand that a Goddess and a wife aren't in competition with one another for my affections because I have entirely different feelings about both, so d) I'll keep it quiet from her that I'm looking for a femdom.

Nope, it's bad for a would-be malesub to bullshit his wife and go off to find a femdom on the quiet, but I'm not inclined to damn such a man instantly to hell. As I said, 'there but for the grace of God go I'.

I trimmed some of this down, peon, so I could address specific points.

I honestly believe that as time goes by, the validity of the argument of having these desires, but that doesn't really exist, becomes less and less. The evidence of such has become increasingly obvious the farther we travel along. It started with books. Then it came to the internet. The media has made it so apparent that BDSM is alive and well that one would have to live under a rock not to realize it. The days of wondering if it is really out there are gone. One doesn't even have to look for it now. It's out there under the very nose of anyone who might even have the slightest interest. Granted, some of the education on the matter isn't really education at all (porn and erotica), but the non fiction is out there, too. It is the responsibility of the intelligent individual to form their opinions based on facts.

Are there people still caught in the middle of the changing of the times? Yes, there certainly are. Yet, I'm not so quick to say that relieves them of their obligations to uphold the vows that they entered into. Before the question of being a good submissive man comes into the picture, you have to look at the basic component of just being a good man.

As hard as it is for folks in these situations, they really have to look at the four potential options:

1) Explain the desires that you have to your wife with the hopes that she will want to become involved or find some kind of compromise where you can participate on some level with someone else.

2) Give up your desires because your integrity is more important.

3) Decide that your kink is more important and conduct activities without the consent of your spouse.

4) Come to the conclusion that the incompatibility between you and your spouse is great enough that the marriage is no longer viable.

That's the cold reality of it.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 10:32:50 AM

LadyHibiscus

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Once again, LP saves me keystrokes!!

And... LP, as one poly person to another, does it seem to you that poly folk are more aggressive about having these kind of feelings? (not dissing the monogamous!)

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 10:56:50 AM

PeonForHer

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The media has made it so apparent that BDSM is alive and well that one would have to live under a rock not to realize it. The days of wondering if it is really out there are gone.

In my case, LP, they've those days have only just gone - roughly two years ago, actually, when I joined CM.  It wasn't that I missed all the stuff in the media about BDSM - I just never believed it.

We all know that there's a strong tendency for people to believe what they want to believe. There's also a tendency, though, for people to do the opposite: to disbelieve in something precisely because they so much want a thing to be true. (Those who believe, far too strongly, in the line 'if it seems too good to be true, then it probably is too good to be true'.)

That was me, regarding femdoms, a few years ago. For me, everything about femdoms was made up - the product of the wishful thinking of males. That's why, for instance and even now, femdom porn is a turn-off for me. The old cynicism in me is a habit that's been slow to die. I just see a bunch of people lying about their feelings. Sometimes I find it depressing, in part because it reminds me of wasted years.

Thing is, I don't know how many other submales are the way that I once was.
I'm figuring I can't be the only one - or can I?   I've never seen any other male on these forums express similar sorts of feelings and beliefs. But, then, a male who's married would never last long enough here to feel comfortable enough to talk about such things. (I don't blame those who react in horror at men who want to cheat, note, I'm just saying that's how it is.)

1) Explain the desires that you have to your wife with the hopes that she will want to become involved or find some kind of compromise where you can participate on some level with someone else.

2) Give up your desires because your integrity is more important.

3) Decide that your kink is more important and conduct activities without the consent of your spouse.

4) Come to the conclusion that the incompatibility between you and your spouse is great enough that the marriage is no longer viable.

That's the cold reality of it.

Yes, it probably is the cold reality of it. But how long it'll take for a man in that position to resolve things in one of those four ways - that's something else. Of all those options, No 2, to me, seems the worst, but still quite a likely option for 'closet, married submales' to take.  Of course, people aren't generally able to give up on their desires. The desires will just remain, crushed down, prolonging the agony and slowly eroding the marriage.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 11:03:29 AM

OttersSwim

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Of all those options, No 2, to me, seems the worst, but still quite a likely option for 'closet, married submales' to take. Of course, people aren't generally able to give up on their desires. The desires will just remain, crushed down, prolonging the agony and slowly eroding the marriage.

This...

Exactly my experience. Of course, my need was not kink, but being transgendered, but the parallel is exact in the deleterious effect of denying our true natures.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 11:24:58 AM

LadyPact

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Once again, LP saves me keystrokes!!

And... LP, as one poly person to another, does it seem to you that poly folk are more aggressive about having these kind of feelings? (not dissing the monogamous!)

I think we are, LH. I believe it stems from our personal knowledge of these things being possible. It comes from living our lives doing the exact thing that people in doubt say can't be done. We know it can happen.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 1:56:35 PM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: OttersSwim

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Of all those options, No 2, to me, seems the worst, but still quite a likely option for 'closet, married submales' to take. Of course, people aren't generally able to give up on their desires. The desires will just remain, crushed down, prolonging the agony and slowly eroding the marriage.

This...

Exactly my experience. Of course, my need was not kink, but being transgendered, but the parallel is exact in the deleterious effect of denying our true natures.

That must have been an utter, complete bastard for you, Otters. I can barely begin to imagine it.

You know, another thought:

I said just earlier that no-one is able to crush down their desires all that effectively. But, people do, routinely. Another one of my favourite proverbs, oft-quited on this board, is 'desires change with the means of achieving them'. If someone comes to the realisation that he's not ever going to be an astronaut, he'll eventually lose that desire from his everyday consciousness.

It's OK, though - we all grow up and eventually ditch a lot of those desires. But some desires are so big that they're not amenable to such ditching The important thing is to know the difference. You did, thank God! But, hell, it can't have been easy for you. Girly-boy notwithstanding, you showed some proper John Wayne true grit there.

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 3:06:33 PM

Ambyant

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Just been contacted by a submissive male; he wants all the grand sensation play and he's married - "eventual divorce".
I am curious if even chatting with one like that is jsut another dead end?

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RE: married subs finding Dommes to serve - 6/22/2010 3:11:50 PM

PeonForHer

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I wouldn't personally go for someone who says she's 'in the process of divorcing' rather than 'having got divorced', Ambyant. Not unless they were already living separately - and even then I'd tread carefully. I've been bitten badly that way before.

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