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RE: Slave rights - 12/16/2007 5:46:26 PM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
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I am not wading through 7 pages of endless debates.

In most relationships, the terms and conditions should be set and agreed
upon by the people involved in the relationship.

If both parties agree to the terms, than what is the damn problem?
Some people are willing to give up more rights than others.
If the parties agree to the slave giving up most or all of their rights, thats their damn business folks. **Unless their is unconsensual abuse or permission is granted by someone not of sound mind, again it's their business"

It aint rocket science here, live and let live.

< Message edited by MzMia -- 12/16/2007 5:48:59 PM >

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RE: Slave rights - 12/16/2007 7:09:19 PM

LittleWench

Posts: 265
Joined: 11/27/2007
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quote:

Reality is that the BDSM community is a sub-culture of a much larger culture.

quote:

IrishMist
Bullshit
That may be YOUR reality; but it certainly is not mine. I don't belong to any so called community.

3,853 posts is a lot for someone who doesn't belong to any so called BDSM community.

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Post #: 142

RE: Slave rights - 12/16/2007 7:29:19 PM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LittleWench

quote:

Reality is that the BDSM community is a sub-culture of a much larger culture.

quote:

IrishMist
Bullshit
That may be YOUR reality; but it certainly is not mine. I don't belong to any so called community.

3,853 posts is a lot for someone who doesn't belong to any so called BDSM community.

I'm not sure what your point is. At first I thought you were wanting to partake in actual give & take conversation. Then I thought maybe you were just trying to be argumentative. Now I have no idea.

But I'll post to this, because I have about double the posts Irish Mist has, and I have never gone to a munch, a play party, a "community event" or anything of the like. I have all these posts because I like participating on a message board. And frankly, I don't know what any of that has to do with the rights I exercise while living under the ownership of my Master.

What's your point?

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Post #: 143

RE: Slave rights - 12/16/2007 10:08:25 PM

LittleWench

Posts: 265
Joined: 11/27/2007
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quote:

But I'll post to this, because I have about double the posts Irish Mist has, and I have never gone to a munch, a play party, a "community event" or anything of the like. I have all these posts because I like participating on a message board. And frankly, I don't know what any of that has to do with the rights I exercise while living under the ownership of my Master.

What's your point?

Trying to illustrate that what Irish sees and says are her reality, and what she actually does, are contradictory.

The first quote states that in reality, the BDSM community is a sub culture of a much larger culture. The retort is bullshit, your reality maybe but not mine. I do not belong to any so called community.

Collarme is an online community, in fact right next to their logo is the saying "The largest online BDSM community on the planet". You don't need a membership card and a secret handshake to consider yourself to be part of a community. The faces here are familiar, we can guess the responses of most of the regulars, we come back regularly not just to hear ourselves speak, but to contribute. We all come here because we get something from it. Whether it is to bitch, or bully, or listen, or vent. I was merely trying to show that whether or not Irish wished to believe she was part of any BDSM community, there are 3,853 posts that say otherwise.... we don't always see our own lives with the perspective that outsiders do.... which is of course a reitteration of my point that regardless of whether one ackowledges basic human rights, whether you see that you have them, you do have them, and whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, you exercise at least some of those rights every single day.

< Message edited by LittleWench -- 12/16/2007 10:10:40 PM >

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RE: Slave rights - 12/16/2007 10:14:16 PM

ownedgirlie

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Well, maybe she was talking about real life communities, not online.

Whatever the case, I am confused by your determination to prove her reality wrong. But, no matter, it's more a curiosity than anything I'm losing sleep over.

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RE: Slave rights - 12/17/2007 9:53:36 AM

whipingherfeet

Posts: 202
Joined: 10/26/2006
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a slave has the right to be on her knees kissing her master feet or ass hole or lick his balls

< Message edited by whipingherfeet -- 12/17/2007 10:42:26 AM >

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Post #: 146

RE: Slave rights - 12/17/2007 9:55:10 AM

slavegirljoy

Posts: 1207
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: North Carolina, USA
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Fast Reply: It's not that i don't have any rights, as my Master's voluntary slave. It's that, within the personal relationship that He and i have together, He has the decision-making power to decide which rights i will be allowed to exercise and when and under what circumstances. That's the type of personal relationship i want to have and that's the type of personal relationship i feel i function best in and that's the type of personal relationship i have with my Master. i chose to become His property and agreed to live under His conditions, His control, and by His decisions. When He took Ownership of me, by my own choosing, i surrendered my will to Him and i relinquished my right to make my own decisions, in favor of my Master having that right. Therefor, instead of me deciding which rights i will choose to exercise, He decides that for me. Being His slave also allows me to exercise my right to practice my religion, which, within my faith, allows for slavery. Besides, my Master has Rights, too. And, for me, it's most important that His rights take precedence over any right that i might have, always, unless He says otherwise. Rights are granted by a governing authority. In my case, my most direct governing authority, in my everyday life, is my Master. i live by His rules and i gladly accept whatever rights He affords me. i am grateful for that opportunity. He has the right, as my Master, to grant me rights, as His property, that i didn't have and wouldn't have, otherwise. Since i love kink and i'm a masochist and submissive, being His slave, gives me the right to enjoy all those things within the safe environment that my Master provides for me. He grants me the right to live in a nice, warm, comfortable and safe home with Him. He grants me the right to take care of my various commitments and obligations that don't involve Him. He grants me the right to make some decisions for myself, with His approval. i am in a voluntary Master/slave relationship. i am not an involuntary servant. The relationship i have with my Master is strictly personal. There is no law that says how an intimate relationship must function. It wasn't that long ago that women willingly gave up their right to own property, their right to make any legal transactions, their right to their own name, their right to be considered an individual entity, etc., in order to become a man's wife. She knowingly surrendered those rights and became the property and responsibility of her husband. That was the law of the land. Well, it may not be the law anymore and, even though i am not married to my Master, i knowingly and willingly surrendered my rights, in order to become the property and responsibility of my Master. To make that choice, of my own free will, is my inherent right. The Oxford Dictionary defines a right as including "a thing one may legally or morally claim; the state of being entitled to a privilege or immunity or authority to act." Rights are not requirements. No one is ever required to exercise their rights. There are plenty of people who never exercise their right to vote or to own a firearm or to practice religion or to drink alcohol, etc. The rights afforded to me, by my government, are there to protect me, not to force me to do something i choose not to do. The 19th Amendment is there to make sure that no one can stop me from voting, if i want to. It's not there to force me to vote, if i don't want to. Oh, by the way, as an American woman, i am not guaranteed any rights under the U.S. Constitution, outside of the Right to Vote, which was granted to women by the 19th Amendment in 1920, some 50 years after the 15th Amendment guaranteed the same right to men, regardless of race, color or ethnicity. Women could have been guaranteed all of the same constitutional rights that men have, had the Equal Rights Amendment been ratified by 3/4 of the states (38 of the 50) but, it didn't happen, falling 3 states shy of that. So, as an American woman, i have only 1 right guaranteed to me by the U.S. Constitution and that is my right to vote, which my Master not only allows me to exercise, just as i have since i turned 18 but, He insists on it. slave joyOwned property of Master David

< Message edited by slavegirljoy -- 12/17/2007 10:01:56 AM >

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RE: Slave rights - 12/18/2007 11:16:03 AM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
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FR (without getting involved too much in this)

The answer is a "Yes" and a "No".

Much like the whole "No Limits"...

Someone can have "No Limits" within the context of a relationship, but extending that scope and implying that an individual has absolutely no limits in a literal and factual sense is silly.

Someone can have "No Rights" within the context of a relationship, but extending that scope and implying that an individual has no rights in a literal and factual sense is even sillier.

The vary definition of consenual slavery implies that they have a right. The right to leave.

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RE: Slave rights - 12/18/2007 12:12:43 PM

BeingChewsie

Posts: 1633
Joined: 10/27/2005
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quote:

The vary definition of consenual slavery implies that they have a right. The right to leave.

Which is why I'm much more interested in what a person has the ability to do vs the right to do. Having the right to do something doesn't mean much if you don't have the ability(physically, psychologically or emotionally) to do it. Our beliefs both drive and constrain our behavior, if you believe something to be "wrong" it may leave you with the right but not the ability to do it. A great example is the small number of police officers a year who when faced with an armed perp find they can't pull the trigger, even though they have the right to do so. In interviews after it often comes out that deep down they believe killing is wrong and for that reason were unable to do something they were well within their rights to do. Many christian women when faced with an unwanted pregnancy or pregnancy that could endanger their life find they are unable to have an abortion. They have the right to do so. They don't have the ability because they believe it to be that wrong. To me the ability to do something is far more important than the right to do something.

< Message edited by BeingChewsie -- 12/18/2007 12:42:24 PM >

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RE: Slave rights - 12/18/2007 1:57:49 PM

slavegirljoy

Posts: 1207
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: North Carolina, USA
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Well Said, MadRabbit! Bravo!

And, of course, the Master has the right to show the slave to the door.

slave joy
Owned property of Master David

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

FR (without getting involved too much in this)

The answer is a "Yes" and a "No".

Much like the whole "No Limits"...

Someone can have "No Limits" within the context of a relationship, but extending that scope and implying that an individual has absolutely no limits in a literal and factual sense is silly.

Someone can have "No Rights" within the context of a relationship, but extending that scope and implying that an individual has no rights in a literal and factual sense is even sillier.

The vary definition of consenual slavery implies that they have a right. The right to leave.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

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Post #: 150

RE: Slave rights - 12/19/2007 6:13:48 PM

Lumus

Posts: 5968
Joined: 9/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavegirljoy

Fast Reply: It's not that i don't have any rights, as my Master's voluntary slave. It's that, within the personal relationship that He and i have together, He has the decision-making power to decide which rights i will be allowed to exercise and when and under what circumstances. That's the type of personal relationship i want to have and that's the type of personal relationship i feel i function best in and that's the type of personal relationship i have with my Master. i chose to become His property and agreed to live under His conditions, His control, and by His decisions. When He took Ownership of me, by my own choosing, i surrendered my will to Him and i relinquished my right to make my own decisions, in favor of my Master having that right. Therefor, instead of me deciding which rights i will choose to exercise, He decides that for me. Being His slave also allows me to exercise my right to practice my religion, which, within my faith, allows for slavery. Besides, my Master has Rights, too. And, for me, it's most important that His rights take precedence over any right that i might have, always, unless He says otherwise. Rights are granted by a governing authority. In my case, my most direct governing authority, in my everyday life, is my Master. i live by His rules and i gladly accept whatever rights He affords me. i am grateful for that opportunity. He has the right, as my Master, to grant me rights, as His property, that i didn't have and wouldn't have, otherwise. Since i love kink and i'm a masochist and submissive, being His slave, gives me the right to enjoy all those things within the safe environment that my Master provides for me. He grants me the right to live in a nice, warm, comfortable and safe home with Him. He grants me the right to take care of my various commitments and obligations that don't involve Him. He grants me the right to make some decisions for myself, with His approval. i am in a voluntary Master/slave relationship. i am not an involuntary servant. The relationship i have with my Master is strictly personal. There is no law that says how an intimate relationship must function. It wasn't that long ago that women willingly gave up their right to own property, their right to make any legal transactions, their right to their own name, their right to be considered an individual entity, etc., in order to become a man's wife. She knowingly surrendered those rights and became the property and responsibility of her husband. That was the law of the land. Well, it may not be the law anymore and, even though i am not married to my Master, i knowingly and willingly surrendered my rights, in order to become the property and responsibility of my Master. To make that choice, of my own free will, is my inherent right. The Oxford Dictionary defines a right as including "a thing one may legally or morally claim; the state of being entitled to a privilege or immunity or authority to act." Rights are not requirements. No one is ever required to exercise their rights. There are plenty of people who never exercise their right to vote or to own a firearm or to practice religion or to drink alcohol, etc. The rights afforded to me, by my government, are there to protect me, not to force me to do something i choose not to do. The 19th Amendment is there to make sure that no one can stop me from voting, if i want to. It's not there to force me to vote, if i don't want to. Oh, by the way, as an American woman, i am not guaranteed any rights under the U.S. Constitution, outside of the Right to Vote, which was granted to women by the 19th Amendment in 1920, some 50 years after the 15th Amendment guaranteed the same right to men, regardless of race, color or ethnicity. Women could have been guaranteed all of the same constitutional rights that men have, had the Equal Rights Amendment been ratified by 3/4 of the states (38 of the 50) but, it didn't happen, falling 3 states shy of that. So, as an American woman, i have only 1 right guaranteed to me by the U.S. Constitution and that is my right to vote, which my Master not only allows me to exercise, just as i have since i turned 18 but, He insists on it. slave joyOwned property of Master David

Because I'm feeling snarky...

How fast a reply could this really have been?

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RE: Slave rights - 12/21/2007 1:31:59 PM

slavegirljoy

Posts: 1207
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: North Carolina, USA
Status: offline

Hey, Mister snarky sparky pants, i said "Fast Reply" not "Short Reply." It didn't really take that long to type it. Speed-typing lessons have really paid-off. Seriously, this is why my Master must maintain strict control over (and often curtail) my Freedom of Speech rights

(No disrespect intended by calling you snarky sparky pants. Hope none is taken.)

slave joy
Owned property of Master David

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lumus

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavegirljoy

Fast Reply: It's not that i don't have any rights, as my Master's voluntary slave. It's that, within the personal relationship that He and i have together, He has the decision-making power to decide which rights i will be allowed to exercise and when and under what circumstances.

Because I'm feeling snarky...

How fast a reply could this really have been?

(in reply to Lumus)

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RE: Slave rights - 12/26/2007 7:22:48 PM

ligar59

Posts: 55
Joined: 9/11/2005
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if he/she chooses to

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RE: Slave rights - 12/26/2007 8:33:13 PM

TheScrivener

Posts: 91
Joined: 8/11/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: whipingherfeet

a slave has the right to be on her knees kissing her master feet or ass hole or lick his balls

Well, what a stellar effort.

Ahem.

MadRabbit covered it quite well. In the context of a relationship, a submissive may not have the "right" to cut her hair, or the "right" to eat whatever she wants, etc, etc, etc. However, at the end of the day, the submissive always has the right to step out of that role, and subsequently, the relationship itself. If you are the kind of person that feels inclined to type out a formal contract (as trivial as that may be in real legality), there should always be some discussion of how the relationship can be brought to a close.

The entire idea of "NO RIGHTS NO LIMITS TRUE SLAVERY" is rather silly. It's not nearly as prevalent here on Collarme as I've seen it on Male/Male oriented sites though.

In the context of a relationship, a slave may have "No rights", but in reality, it's simply an extension of the basic forms of play we partake in. If it weren't, you'd have real slavery - and you'd be breaking one hell of a law.

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