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Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 9:23:52 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
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This is sarcasm, be warned but like all sarcasm, there is truth in its core
 
Prior to addressing me, you are honor bound to read the following to ensure you address me properly as well as to ensure that you accord me the honor I am due.
 
http://www.collarchat.com/m_1539584/mpage_4/key_Acolyte/tm.htm#1543359

Ladies and Gentleman,
 
Today I am going to lecture you on training.  Long have those in my house kept our standards of training secret.  As befitting my new stature as leader of the BDSM community I have chosen to publish the ancient and secret standards of how my sacred European house trains submissives and I am hereby establishing them as the standards by which all BDSM training will be conducted.

[/Sarcasm]

For many on the boards, the concept of being a "trainer" is ludicrous but the erotic content of it is high and so for many who are new it is an idea they long for.  It is at the core of the Beauty series as well as the Marketplace.  Hell, even I find elements of it hot and agree that there is a place for it in reality and it can be done in a useful and healthy manner for a NARROW range of things and with specific intent in mind.

That said, I have a thought (the sort that certain people here hate) of what to do about all this.  When someone mentions they are a "trainer" ask for whom.  Seriously.  Who specifically are you training for, do you want to be trained for that person?  As a trainer, who trains people for you?  If nobody does, why not, are you not good enough?

Imagine how if we put the concept in place that training was okay but that it was important to know WHO you were being trained for, how that might change things.  You could go ask the intended recipient questions, you could ask others who were trained.

Anyway, I toss this scrap of red meat into the fray for the "whats wrong with how we do it now" folks to argue with the "its all just semantics" crowd and the various other factions to tear apart and devour.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 9:32:30 AM   
Leatherist


Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline
Micheal....if I let out my veeblefetzer repair secrets-then EVERYONE would be doing it!

And it would become a FAD and no longer special!!!!
 
And then,where would I BE?

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
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RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 9:33:54 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
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Ha! This is a trick question.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
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RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 9:40:15 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline
I don't see how you could apply standards across the board. Everyone is different. I suppose that there could be basic standards. After that it is whatever your best suited for.  

(in reply to Dnomyar)
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RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 9:42:02 AM   
subtee


Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Micheal....if I let out my veeblefetzer repair secrets-then EVERYONE would be doing it!

And it would become a FAD and no longer special!!!!
 
And then,where would I BE?


Excuse me, isn't this your "cum on command," er, command?

_____________________________

Don't believe everything you think...

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RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 9:43:29 AM   
Leatherist


Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline
It's whatever I want it to be. 

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

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Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 10:05:19 AM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
The only person who can train someone to serve Me is Me. I can work with someone to overcome specific problems, give them experience of different things but can't train them to serve another because I do things MY way, someone else will require it done THEIR way. end of!

"Come girl and I will train you to be able to serve your future Master"... IMO is bullshit and a dim feeding someone a line, trying to get 'use' of the girl, short term for little to no commitment or effort and doing so in an underhand deceptive manner. YMMV


_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

(in reply to Leatherist)
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RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 10:07:16 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse

The only person who can train someone to serve Me is Me. I can work with someone to overcome specific problems, give them experience of different things but can't train them to serve another because I do things MY way, someone else will require it done THEIR way. end of!

"Come girl and I will train you to be able to serve your future Master"... IMO is bullshit and a dim feeding someone a line, trying to get 'use' of the girl, short term for little to no commitment or effort and doing so in an underhand deceptive manner. YMMV


EXACTLY!!!

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 10:22:29 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline
There used to be a domme at b.com who called herself a trainer. When asked what she taught, basically it came down to manners. Seriously she chose people who didn't have decent table manners or conversational skills and taught them to behave in company.

What's always bothered me about that is how bad her self esteem had to be, that she sought out people she could feel superior to, and that the only skill she thought ever made her superior was having read an etiquette book. That bothered me, a lot.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to SimplyMichael)
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RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 10:40:02 AM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
There is a big diference is honestly offering to give someone experience of various, agreed aspects of WIITWD or work on helping the girl over a particular discussed problem.... but taining her to be able to serve some undisclosed future Master, some future Master whos standards and requirements are simply not known, that I certainly don't take at face value.

_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 10:46:48 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse

The only person who can train someone to serve Me is Me. I can work with someone to overcome specific problems, give them experience of different things but can't train them to serve another because I do things MY way, someone else will require it done THEIR way. end of!

"Come girl and I will train you to be able to serve your future Master"... IMO is bullshit and a dim feeding someone a line, trying to get 'use' of the girl, short term for little to no commitment or effort and doing so in an underhand deceptive manner. YMMV



My thoughts exactly.


_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 10:46:53 AM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
This is why I prefer subs and slaves with no expereince. They havent been taught how to "serve". I am the only one who could teach someone how to serve the way I want to be served. The boys I ahve now do not both serve in the same way, so their training with me has not ben the same. I can only teach someone to serve me.
I cannot train someone to serve someone else, becasue I cant think like someone else and think of all the possible talents someone might need to learn. If I dont like a specific activity, I cannot and will not teach it to someone. So then, if whomever I have trained meets someone who wants X, which I despise, they are out of luck.
I train pets for myself, everyone else can do their own work.

DV




_____________________________

I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

Snarko Ergo Sum
If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

*Owner of Fox - collared 10/13/07*
VampiresLair

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 11:00:09 AM   
lronitulstahp


Posts: 5392
Joined: 10/17/2007
Status: offline
quote:

  "Come girl and I will train you to be able to serve your future Master"... IMO is bullshit and a dim feeding someone a line, trying to get 'use' of the girl, short term for little to no commitment or effort and doing so in an underhand deceptive manner. YMMV 

NOW...they tell me!!!!! Sheesh.....

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 12:17:53 PM   
MamaDomme1


Posts: 377
Joined: 1/12/2008
Status: offline
But, but, but Michael!  We took that Blood Oath, swearing we would never reveal our sources or our methods when we were inititated into the upper echelon of the BDSM Leadership Community!

Now you've gone and done it-- you are telling our secrets!

And really, I would much rather train my own subs/slaves to my desires and needs rather than them coming with someone else expectations.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 12:44:43 PM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse

The only person who can train someone to serve Me is Me. I can work with someone to overcome specific problems, give them experience of different things but can't train them to serve another because I do things MY way, someone else will require it done THEIR way. end of!

"Come girl and I will train you to be able to serve your future Master"... IMO is bullshit and a dim feeding someone a line, trying to get 'use' of the girl, short term for little to no commitment or effort and doing so in an underhand deceptive manner. YMMV



Shhhhhhhhhhhhh...those are the "uber" dominants that do not just teach D/s but BDSM play along with teaching, through demonstration, how sex is important to BDSM play and D/s dynamics and how it ties in to pleasure...and that is the ONLY reason for intimate touching in their case:  to teach.  Certainly NOT to bind the submissive to them or to encourage a feeling that the submissive belongs to the Trainer on any level.

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 12:48:06 PM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DiurnalVampire

This is why I prefer subs and slaves with no expereince. They havent been taught how to "serve". I am the only one who could teach someone how to serve the way I want to be served. The boys I ahve now do not both serve in the same way, so their training with me has not ben the same. I can only teach someone to serve me.
I cannot train someone to serve someone else, becasue I cant think like someone else and think of all the possible talents someone might need to learn. If I dont like a specific activity, I cannot and will not teach it to someone. So then, if whomever I have trained meets someone who wants X, which I despise, they are out of luck.
I train pets for myself, everyone else can do their own work.

DV



DV...don't you know that protocol is the SAME across the board for all dominants?  Think of the time and energy saved by these who so willingly and unselfishly give of their time to train boys/girls how to kneel, how to bow, how to crawl, how to receive a whip strike, how to receive a flogging, how to have nipple clamps applied properly and what all these things should feel like.

(in reply to DiurnalVampire)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 1:00:56 PM   
Prinsexx


Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline
I thought it said Trading Standards Authority and I was going to get outed and busted again.......
oh yer the 'I'm training her to take anal' brigade........ wtf???



_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 1:01:46 PM   
MastrVran


Posts: 354
Joined: 3/15/2006
Status: offline
I will be different just because I can be.

Training is almost never designed as some poeple seem to think for the slave to learn how to please any Master in the future. I for one, could not care less who the slave may end up with 5 minutes, 5 days, weeks, months, years or decades down the road. training has nothing whatsoever to do with the slaves potential owner. It has to do with unleashing the feelings within. Allowing them a range of expression in a safe, controlled enviroment where she can learn what various things mean, how they effect her, if they effect her and if they are just plain wrong for her. (BTW...a female noun will be used by me most of the time, however, replace it with any you think fits your style better.)

Training can be simply showing someone a technique, demonstrating it on them, allowing them to try it on someone with you there to guide and help. While I agree many people, especially online, use and view training to really mean, come over and I will tie you up and lay you,  this will help make you a better slave/sub. And it might at that. But for anyone who thinks of training as I do, its simply teaching others things about themselves.

Now many on here will also say this is wrong because only their future partner should be doing this. Really? Like everyone here was a virgin on your wedding day. And for both of you who may have been, did you marriage last? And if so do you wonder if you made the right choice or simply the first choice?

Anything that increases a persons knowledge of themselves, of their reactions, of their likes or dislikes, of their fears, loves, needs is not a bad thing. Now I will say just saying you are a trainer to get laid is simply a bad thing. And yeah, with online you get hammered with that a lot. But training is not simply about a persons sexual needs and/or nature, though for many it is definately a large part of this. I see training as simply teaching someone things they wish to learn and know. Mostly it will be about them. Not about that future someone who may or may not exist. There was a thread I saw the other day all about, a slave asked if she should  try to find someone who does the things she liked or just be a slave and take anything he wanted. The question that came to my mind, was how do you know what you like till you have experienced it? And once you have a clue, I would certainly recommend finding someone who at least mostly fits in with your needs and desires, anything else is a road to ruin someday.

So, obviously some of you have certain beliefs that training is BS. I can live with that. Some of what you say I find amusing. Everyone has different beliefs, some of you want a virgin canvas to work with. Unfortunately in todays society, by the time someone is of legal age to have sex and enter this lifestyle, the odds are they already have. If by coming to see a trainer a slave gains some knowledge, once they are old enough, even if its just a small amount, she is better off than she was. Same of course goes for Doms, any knowledge gained has uses.

Just realize that no where in this have I recommended someone go to a trainer who appears to be an HNG. Nor would I ever recommend going to anyone, without a lot of background on them, references, and other checks.

But training, while laughed at by some, has a real use when applied correctly and with certain things in mind. It is not an end in itself. It is simply a chance for someone to explore some sides of themselves hopefully with someone qualified in the area they want to explore. Like going to a club and having an expert flogger, do a flogging on you. To me...thats a form of training. You have gained knowledge from it. Why is going to a trainer any different and horrible, if he does the same thing that you would have gotten at a club?

Just my way of looking at things, as always.

MV 

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 1:11:49 PM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MastrVran

I will be different just because I can be.

Training is almost never designed as some poeple seem to think for the slave to learn how to please any Master in the future. I for one, could not care less who the slave may end up with 5 minutes, 5 days, weeks, months, years or decades down the road. training has nothing whatsoever to do with the slaves potential owner. It has to do with unleashing the feelings within. Allowing them a range of expression in a safe, controlled enviroment where she can learn what various things mean, how they effect her, if they effect her and if they are just plain wrong for her. (BTW...a female noun will be used by me most of the time, however, replace it with any you think fits your style better.)

Training can be simply showing someone a technique, demonstrating it on them, allowing them to try it on someone with you there to guide and help. While I agree many people, especially online, use and view training to really mean, come over and I will tie you up and lay you,  this will help make you a better slave/sub. And it might at that. But for anyone who thinks of training as I do, its simply teaching others things about themselves.

Now many on here will also say this is wrong because only their future partner should be doing this. Really? Like everyone here was a virgin on your wedding day. And for both of you who may have been, did you marriage last? And if so do you wonder if you made the right choice or simply the first choice?

Anything that increases a persons knowledge of themselves, of their reactions, of their likes or dislikes, of their fears, loves, needs is not a bad thing. Now I will say just saying you are a trainer to get laid is simply a bad thing. And yeah, with online you get hammered with that a lot. But training is not simply about a persons sexual needs and/or nature, though for many it is definately a large part of this. I see training as simply teaching someone things they wish to learn and know. Mostly it will be about them. Not about that future someone who may or may not exist. There was a thread I saw the other day all about, a slave asked if she should  try to find someone who does the things she liked or just be a slave and take anything he wanted. The question that came to my mind, was how do you know what you like till you have experienced it? And once you have a clue, I would certainly recommend finding someone who at least mostly fits in with your needs and desires, anything else is a road to ruin someday.

So, obviously some of you have certain beliefs that training is BS. I can live with that. Some of what you say I find amusing. Everyone has different beliefs, some of you want a virgin canvas to work with. Unfortunately in todays society, by the time someone is of legal age to have sex and enter this lifestyle, the odds are they already have. If by coming to see a trainer a slave gains some knowledge, once they are old enough, even if its just a small amount, she is better off than she was. Same of course goes for Doms, any knowledge gained has uses.

Just realize that no where in this have I recommended someone go to a trainer who appears to be an HNG. Nor would I ever recommend going to anyone, without a lot of background on them, references, and other checks.

But training, while laughed at by some, has a real use when applied correctly and with certain things in mind. It is not an end in itself. It is simply a chance for someone to explore some sides of themselves hopefully with someone qualified in the area they want to explore. Like going to a club and having an expert flogger, do a flogging on you. To me...thats a form of training. You have gained knowledge from it. Why is going to a trainer any different and horrible, if he does the same thing that you would have gotten at a club?

Just my way of looking at things, as always.

MV 


And my question to you...asked in all seriousness...is this:  what separates you, given the fact that you admit that sexual exploration most likely will be involved, from the HNGs who come on as trainers?  Because you state that you look at it differently?  Because you state that you are showing them their fears in a safe environment and what brings them pleasure in a safe environment?  Or is it because you are able to state in your own mind that you know that you are not their dominant and you disclaim that to them before every time you take them to a point where they want to give themselves to you?  I am quite sure that most other trainers/mentors state the same thing...what makes you different?

Forgive me if this seems a bit snide but it sounds a bit to me like those in my own profession and in the medical profession who state that they see 50 patients a day because they have a "calling to serve as much of humanity as possible".  Perhaps I am a bit cynical.

(in reply to MastrVran)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Official Training Standards - 4/17/2008 1:15:48 PM   
Leatherist


Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline
I always just called it goofing off with a friend.

I'm so informal, I just don't even qualify as a master.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to CreativeDominant)
Profile   Post #: 20
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