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Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 6:57:42 PM

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Gunman kills man with Alzheimers and walks away free.

One Man Lost and Impaired, the Other Fearful and Armed

There is a perfect match between these facts and GotSteel's thread:

http://www.collarchat.com/m_4643110/tm.htm

-------------

Mr. Hendrix took a handgun, hurried out into the darkness and shouted at Mr. Westbrook.

But Mr. Westbrook, who was carrying a flashlight that was not turned on, did not answer.

“Westbrook never verbally responded to Hendrix but began to advance towards Hendrix in what Hendrix described as a quick and aggressive manner,” Mr. Franklin said. “Hendrix could only see a silhouette figure carrying a cylindrical object in his hand but could not make out anything else.”

Mr. Hendrix kept yelling at Mr. Westbrook, who the authorities said “continued to advance towards Hendrix in the same manner.”

Mr. Hendrix then fired, striking Mr. Westbrook once in the chest.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 3/1/2014 6:59:26 PM >

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:03:48 PM

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Shoot first, ask questions later.

Don't fire a warning shot.

Instead of confronting someone in a normal manner (Hi, can I help you?) or relying on the Police when there is no imminent danger, confront the person armed, fearful, and paranoid.

--------

Mr. Westbrook’s widow herself is not sure that Mr. Hendrix should be charged.

“I don’t know what his mind-set was, and I don’t know enough about the law to know,” Mrs. Westbrook said. “But that’s all over now. His life is already taken. He took the life of a real gentle man, and it’s a crying shame.”

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 3/1/2014 7:10:59 PM >

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:13:30 PM

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The murderers in these recent stand your ground cases -- Zimmerman et. al. strike me as cowards.

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:17:21 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

There is a perfect match between these facts and GotSteel's thread:

http://www.collarchat.com/m_4643110/tm.htm

So let's see what you left out. Sometime around 4am Westbrook tried to open Hendrix's door. Alarmed, Hendrix's fiancée called 911. Westbrook, after failing to gain entry by the front door, moved to the back of the house. At this point, Hendrix stepped out and challenged him. But Westbrook did not respond and instead advanced on Hendrix with what appeared to be a cylindrical pipe-like object in his hand.

Is there no limit to the misrepresentations some people will descend to?

K.

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:24:38 PM

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I'm sorry, but there is no way I would shoot an 71 year old man with Alzheimers carrying a flashlight. I don't automatically assume someone else at my door or on my property is a criminal or armed and dangerous.

Gun owners are striking me more and more as cowards.

Why do you have to reach for a gun to confront someone?

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 3/1/2014 7:25:35 PM >

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:43:45 PM

Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I'm sorry, but there is no way I would shoot an 71 year old man with Alzheimers carrying a flashlight. I don't automatically assume someone else at my door or on my property is a criminal or armed and dangerous.

Gun owners are striking me more and more as cowards.

Why do you have to reach for a gun to confront someone?

First, the shooter knew the victim had Alzheimer's how?

Second, strange people always come up to houses in the dark and early morning just to try to get in to what? clean the house? play pinochle? None of them ever have a criminal motive?

The shooter told the old man to stop a number of times, and was ignored. This instills a sense of security?

And the shooter had perfect night vision, could see the victim was an elderly gentleman with no hostile intent, holding an object in his hand that was clearly a flashlight?

Please, show me how any of these questions indicate a positive on the part of the shooter.

Please tell me how the shooter knew the victim had alzheimer's.

Then tell me why he should not consider someone trying to gain entrance to his home after midnight as non threatening, unless the shooter had a teenager, who was out late and had forgotten his key and he (shooter) was aware of his child's plight?

Now I may be crazy, and stupid, but if I were approaching someone's in the home and wanted to get their attention, I sure as hell would not try to open the fucking door. I would hammer on the door, yell, scream, hopefully in the process either waking the homeowner or the neighbors if not both.

And sorry, if someone tries to get into my home at night, after I went to bed, without saying a fucking word, you are damn right I am gonna show up at the door with a loaded gun. I mean even the police shout "search warrant" before they bust your door down.

But you are right, it is strictly the gun owners fault for not figuring out the victim was harmless.

The truth is, his failure was not firing a warning shot, and even that is questionable. Firing a warning shot while the other person may have a firearm of his own is a good way to get your ass killed, but then that is because the bad guy had a gun, that he probably acquired illegally.

You know, I said I would never shoot at a kid (teenager) when told about stuff that happened to guys who served in Viet Nam. I did, and killed a couple of teenagers, and you know why? Those little bastards were firing AK's at my ass.

Now you want to go on about how old men and kids are always harmless?

< Message edited by jlf1961 -- 3/1/2014 7:47:09 PM >

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:51:11 PM

BamaD

Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Shoot first, ask questions later.

Don't fire a warning shot.

Instead of confronting someone in a normal manner (Hi, can I help you?) or relying on the Police when there is no imminent danger, confront the person armed, fearful, and paranoid.

--------

Mr. Westbrook’s widow herself is not sure that Mr. Hendrix should be charged.

“I don’t know what his mind-set was, and I don’t know enough about the law to know,” Mrs. Westbrook said. “But that’s all over now. His life is already taken. He took the life of a real gentle man, and it’s a crying shame.”

Where would the warning shot land, in another thread you advocated locking a person up for firing one.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:53:22 PM

BamaD

Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I'm sorry, but there is no way I would shoot an 71 year old man with Alzheimers carrying a flashlight. I don't automatically assume someone else at my door or on my property is a criminal or armed and dangerous.

Gun owners are striking me more and more as cowards.

Why do you have to reach for a gun to confront someone?

How would you know his age, in the dark?
How would you know he had Alzheimers?
How would you know it was just a flashlight?

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:53:58 PM

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Joined: 8/2/2006
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FR

Oh, dear God. This is heartbreaking.

Two thoughts:

(a) I wonder why the sheriff's deputy who'd seen Westbrook earlier in the evening didn't offer him a lift home or to a safe place.

(b) Hendrix's lawyer said that 11 minutes is a long time with someone on the other side of the door. Probably. Then again, if the person is still on the other side of the door after that long, how much of a threat can he actually be?

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to jlf1961)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 7:54:02 PM

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Joined: 6/3/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I'm sorry, but there is no way I would shoot an 71 year old man with Alzheimers carrying a flashlight. I don't automatically assume someone else at my door or on my property is a criminal or armed and dangerous.

Gun owners are striking me more and more as cowards.

Why do you have to reach for a gun to confront someone?

And in the dark, at 4am, you'd instantly be able to tell that the person approaching you, and refusing to respond when you yelled to them, was a 71yo Alzheimer's patient? As opposed to say a crack-head trying to break in and rob you?

Why reach for a gun? Because you have no idea what the person you're confronting might have? Someone was trying to enter his home at 4am, then was walking around his yard headed for the back door. Maybe you've never had someone try to break-in to your home, I have and it's not a pleasant experience.

Shoot first and ask questions later? Didn't your own report state that he repeatedly yelled at the person, and only fired when the person refused to respond and advanced on him?

Fire a warning shot? Which is illegal. There have been several cases fairly recently of people going to prison for firing warning shots.

Why was this person wandering the streets at 4am? My wife went senile a few years ago, brain tumor and the "treatment" for it, to the point that she became dangerous to be around at times. She tried to kill me on one occasion with a marble desk lamp. I had to put child locks on my knife drawers and buy a gun safe. This is a sad case, but I can say for a fact that just because someone is senile they can still be dangerous. I also made damn sure that I knew where she was at all times, she never went wandering in the middle of the night because we took measures to prevent it.

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 8:01:44 PM

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

There is a perfect match between these facts and GotSteel's thread:

http://www.collarchat.com/m_4643110/tm.htm

So let's see what you left out. Sometime around 4am Westbrook tried to open Hendrix's door. Alarmed, Hendrix's fiancée called 911. Westbrook, after failing to gain entry by the front door, moved to the back of the house. At this point, Hendrix stepped out and challenged him. But Westbrook did not respond and instead advanced on Hendrix with what appeared to be a cylindrical pipe-like object in his hand.

Is there no limit to the misrepresentations some people will descend to?

K.

Yeah.....shit happens all the time......

"
Ohio boy, 8, fatally shot by brother who was playing with a loaded handgun he thought was just a BB gun

Sammy Lorenzo, 8, was taken to Cincinnati Children's Hospital and rushed into surgery, but later died
Cincinnati homicide detectives are investigating the case but concluded that the shooting was accidental
Sammy's brother, whose name has not been released, thought the handgun was only a BB gun
No charges are expected against the children

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2571212/Police-Ohio-boy-8-fatally-shot-brother.html#ixzz2um5MLujv
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

It`s the parents that should face jail time...

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 8:03:15 PM

BamaD

Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

FR

Oh, dear God. This is heartbreaking.

Two thoughts:

(a) I wonder why the sheriff's deputy who'd seen Westbrook earlier in the evening didn't offer him a lift home or to a safe place.

(b) Hendrix's lawyer said that 11 minutes is a long time with someone on the other side of the door. Probably. Then again, if the person is still on the other side of the door after that long, how much of a threat can he actually be?

A lot.
Haven't seen you in awhile, does this mean you are doing better?

< Message edited by BamaD -- 3/1/2014 8:05:15 PM >

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to dcnovice)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 8:08:14 PM

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I'm sorry, but there is no way I would shoot an 71 year old man with Alzheimers carrying a flashlight. I don't automatically assume someone else at my door or on my property is a criminal or armed and dangerous.

Gun owners are striking me more and more as cowards.

Why do you have to reach for a gun to confront someone?

Before a good offense can be the best defense, you first have to have one.

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 3/1/2014 8:24:18 PM >

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 10:10:03 PM

Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

There is a perfect match between these facts and GotSteel's thread:

http://www.collarchat.com/m_4643110/tm.htm

So let's see what you left out. Sometime around 4am Westbrook tried to open Hendrix's door. Alarmed, Hendrix's fiancée called 911. Westbrook, after failing to gain entry by the front door, moved to the back of the house. At this point, Hendrix stepped out and challenged him. But Westbrook did not respond and instead advanced on Hendrix with what appeared to be a cylindrical pipe-like object in his hand.

Is there no limit to the misrepresentations some people will descend to?

K.

Yeah.....shit happens all the time......

Shit happens? That's your take on this? Interesting.

"
Ohio boy, 8, fatally shot by brother who was playing with a loaded handgun he thought was just a BB gun

Sammy Lorenzo, 8, was taken to Cincinnati Children's Hospital and rushed into surgery, but later died
Cincinnati homicide detectives are investigating the case but concluded that the shooting was accidental
Sammy's brother, whose name has not been released, thought the handgun was only a BB gun
No charges are expected against the children

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2571212/Police-Ohio-boy-8-fatally-shot-brother.html#ixzz2um5MLujv
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

It`s the parents that should face jail time...

Yes they should and while that is very sad it has nothing to do with the topic.

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert

This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi

(in reply to Owner59)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 10:28:48 PM

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Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

Let's hope that you don't confront others with a gun; that might be a good start.

This story illustrates how gun ownership punishes the owner and the victim. There's downside risk all around.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 3/1/2014 10:29:34 PM >

(in reply to jlf1961)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 10:32:12 PM

BamaD

Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Let's hope that you don't confront others with a gun; that might be a good start.

This story illustrates how gun ownership punishes the owner and the victim. There's downside risk all around.

Mr. Westbrook is a victim of his own actions.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/1/2014 10:32:28 PM

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Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

FR

Having seen enough of it, I've actually put out there quite clearly among the family that if I get Alzheimer's, someone is supposed to shoot me.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to cloudboy)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/2/2014 12:06:22 AM

Rule

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Joined: 12/5/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
Sometime around 4am Westbrook tried to open Hendrix's door.

In my opinion everybody ought to be in bed or inside during the night - unless they have work or tasks to do, or are making a night walk.

In my opinion Mr. Westbrook was lucky to get killed, considering his disease. One might even suppose that he was killed due to Divine intervention (in response to whomever's spiritual request).

_____________________________

"I tend to pay attention when Rule speaks" - Aswad

"You are sweet, kind, and ever so smart, Rule. You ALWAYS stretch my mind and make me think further than I might have on my own" - Duskypearls

Si vis pacem, para bellum.

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/2/2014 12:33:47 AM

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Joined: 7/24/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Let's hope that you don't confront others with a gun; that might be a good start.

This story illustrates how gun ownership punishes the owner and the victim. There's downside risk all around.

Mr. Westbrook is a victim of his own actions.

No he's not. He had a real medical illness. Or did you not READ the article?

Most likely he was confused and believing he was at his own house. He didn't have the key and no one familiar was coming to the door to help. What do most people do when they get locked out of their houses when its cold outside? They look for a way in, right? Or break in, right?

But Mr. Gun Owner decided to go on the offensive, confront the individual without no clue what he was up against, and assume a huge amount of facts without evidence to back it up. Here's the first question, why did he leave the residence? Why not simply semi-open a window and try to identify the subject in some sane manner?

In this sad case, everyone lost, including the gun owner. Yeah, he isn't going to jail, but I think he has something much worst....he made a terrible mistake. An he has to live with that guilt for the rest of his days.

(in reply to BamaD)

RE: Senseless shooting: Gunman kills man with Alzheimers - 3/2/2014 5:06:24 AM

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I'm sorry, but there is no way I would shoot an 71 year old man with Alzheimers carrying a flashlight. I don't automatically assume someone else at my door or on my property is a criminal or armed and dangerous.

Gun owners are striking me more and more as cowards.

Why do you have to reach for a gun to confront someone?

How would you know his age, in the dark?
How would you know he had Alzheimers?
How would you know it was just a flashlight?

Turn on a light.

(in reply to BamaD)

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