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RE: Teenish Masters - 12/20/2006 10:16:05 PM

Posts: 3403
Joined: 8/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalira

OMG LMAO that visual is sooooooooo funny.

Spandex suit with the words 'superslavetrainer' in bright letters across the front, holding a plastic flogger in one hand and a kiddy cane in the other.

LOL omg

What would the signal be to call for him? The BDSM symbol projected onto the clouds?

Probably could just stick with the traditional S if you're looking for a sadist.

_____________________________

Finding a good sub is like sifting through trail mix. You find a few fruits, a lotta nuts and have to sift to get to the sweet and special ones
drama llama

(in reply to AquaticSub)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 4:56:44 AM

Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline

Greetings theRose4U,

One persons "unicorns and faeries" can be another persons reality. I am trying to understand better the problems between the BDSM community and the Gorean one, since I came from the BDSM side to the Gorean way. What drove your comment? Was it that you have had alot of exposure to just online Goreans that RP or have you ever truly known a Gorean that practices the lifestyle RT and upholds the philosophies of Gor? I truly wish to know so that I can better understand and educate on both sides of what seems to me as a ridiculous war between lifestyles. So as not to hi jack this thread you can contact me privately with your answer or post it in under another thread on the Gorean boards. Since I have invited you to the Gorean boards, as long as you are respectful there, I will defend any disrespect towards you from any Gorean posting there. Just put in your reply that I asked you there. This does not guarantee anything of course but respect of a guest, as long as they are respectful, should be a basic philosophy most Goreans would recognize. This invitation extends to anyone else as well, I would truly like to see some dialogue so that everyone can better understand each other in this.

I believe much of this war can be done away with if we stop making generalized derogatory comments and better understand each other. Understanding does not mean agreeing with.

Orion

quote:

ORIGINAL: theRose4U

quote:

People are allowed to become husbands and fathers at age 19

I wasn't aware that there's an age limit. I wish you had been around to explain this to my niece it might have saved her a great deal of heartache, a baby and a divorce at 17.

quote:

i could have my control and i wouldnt have to fight the girl involved for it if she was a sub. she would happily give up the control i needed.

Further reading the Gor perspective expains a lot. I WAS going to ask where these amazing creatures that prostrate themselves at the sight of a dominant dewll until I realized it was with the unicorns and faries.

(in reply to theRose4U)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 5:41:19 AM

LordODiscipline

Posts: 995
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

One persons "unicorns and faeries" can be another persons reality.

You might want to reconsider this statement if you are at all looking for people to take you (and, Gor?) seriously.

Although, it did give me a good chuckle.

~J

_____________________________

"Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential."
William Thomas

(in reply to OrionTheWolf)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 5:59:37 AM

Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline

It is their decision really on whether to take me seriously. The comment is not untrue though, because one person may see something as unrealistic, while another may not. I would think that many years ago, someone talking about suspending themselves with fish hooks may have seen like fantasy, or some other thing that is associated with BDSM. Some believe it is fantasy to just be able to live off the land, while others actually practice it very closely. I believe that most misunderstandings come from miscommunication.

Orion

quote:

ORIGINAL: LordODiscipline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

One persons "unicorns and faeries" can be another persons reality.

You might want to reconsider this statement if you are at all looking for people to take you (and, Gor?) seriously.

Although, it did give me a good chuckle.

~J

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 9:15:08 AM

LordODiscipline

Posts: 995
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

It was meant as a mostly humerous and slightly serious cautionary...

You are obviously missing the point if you are placing the 'probable' (hooks in a real body) with the 'impossible' (unicorns and fairies) as equivallent, etc.

If communication is important (*and, I agree that it is), then this is a serious miscommunication which does not lend toward having people take a position as seriously as you may desire.

But - hey... have at it as you desire... I am not concerned.

~J

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

It is their decision really on whether to take me seriously. The comment is not untrue though, because one person may see something as unrealistic, while another may not. I would think that many years ago, someone talking about suspending themselves with fish hooks may have seen like fantasy, or some other thing that is associated with BDSM. Some believe it is fantasy to just be able to live off the land, while others actually practice it very closely. I believe that most misunderstandings come from miscommunication.

Orion

_____________________________

"Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential."
William Thomas

(in reply to OrionTheWolf)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 12:12:30 PM

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DevilsVendetta

Alright. Well since most "teen masters" never read the boards lol, I guess I'll sit here and defend them, well... maybe not the vast majority of totally incompetent ones.

Firstly, I'd like to say, all the negative aspects most people see in teen Doms, can often be seen in people 25-55. Often enough I've stumbled on profiles of middle aged men who obviously just wanted an excuse to get laid and take advantage of some poor stupid 19 year old girl. The negative aspects we can see in Doms has no age barrier, there are plenty of inexperienced, think-theyre-god Doms who are 40.

Now, back on the subject. How could I possibly think I'm a competent master at 19. Perhaps, we must all begin learning this somewhere. I've been interested in this lifestyle for a few years now, and have experienced it myself to some degree. I don't claim to know everything and be able to write books on the subject. Now, if we all didnt perpetuate this whole "young Doms cannot possibly know a thing" PERHAPS, we'd have less idiots on this site. Simple as this, is these Doms are consistantly getting bashed and flamed, they see no reason to stay. So what we're left with is all these idiots. I think many people on this site so easily portray the Domlier-than-thou attitude which just makes me laugh. This is a website. What are you trying to prove, I could just as easily be the 40 year old master with years of experience... your e-ego doesn't impress me.

So how about, for once, we chill out on the younger Doms and let them live it out and learn. Experience isn't everythign my friend, I'm sure theres some idiots on this site who could easy be put to shame by someone under 20. I rarely post on the boards, but I do like to observe, and some of you just crack me up. Some of you are simply little boys on a power trip who happen to be old enough to grow a beard.

Now I know this doesn't apply to all of you, but it does to a very large number. So now I await your hurt little e-egos, get your panties up in a bunch and flame me. I welcome it.

My issue is this: Can you get started TOO early in all this and mess up your mind for any future relationships? For example- people into Goth. They WILL look back on it and be soooooooooooo embarrassed. People do things in WIITWD on an impulse or in trying to prove themselves that may mark them for life.

Or in their wild enthusiasm.. may mark the submissive for life.

We aren't play with Barbi dolls here.. it's actual people. If yo break one, you have to fix them. And if life experience is limited as to people in general..,how would you know if you did mental damage? It's kind of like giving a loaded gun to an unmentionable. When is TOO soon?

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to DevilsVendetta)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 12:57:16 PM

Posts: 63
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: DevilsVendetta

Alright. Well since most "teen masters" never read the boards lol, I guess I'll sit here and defend them, well... maybe not the vast majority of totally incompetent ones.

Firstly, I'd like to say, all the negative aspects most people see in teen Doms, can often be seen in people 25-55. Often enough I've stumbled on profiles of middle aged men who obviously just wanted an excuse to get laid and take advantage of some poor stupid 19 year old girl. The negative aspects we can see in Doms has no age barrier, there are plenty of inexperienced, think-theyre-god Doms who are 40.

Now, back on the subject. How could I possibly think I'm a competent master at 19. Perhaps, we must all begin learning this somewhere. I've been interested in this lifestyle for a few years now, and have experienced it myself to some degree. I don't claim to know everything and be able to write books on the subject. Now, if we all didnt perpetuate this whole "young Doms cannot possibly know a thing" PERHAPS, we'd have less idiots on this site. Simple as this, is these Doms are consistantly getting bashed and flamed, they see no reason to stay. So what we're left with is all these idiots. I think many people on this site so easily portray the Domlier-than-thou attitude which just makes me laugh. This is a website. What are you trying to prove, I could just as easily be the 40 year old master with years of experience... your e-ego doesn't impress me.

So how about, for once, we chill out on the younger Doms and let them live it out and learn. Experience isn't everythign my friend, I'm sure theres some idiots on this site who could easy be put to shame by someone under 20. I rarely post on the boards, but I do like to observe, and some of you just crack me up. Some of you are simply little boys on a power trip who happen to be old enough to grow a beard.

Now I know this doesn't apply to all of you, but it does to a very large number. So now I await your hurt little e-egos, get your panties up in a bunch and flame me. I welcome it.

My issue is this: Can you get started TOO early in all this and mess up your mind for any future relationships? For example- people into Goth. They WILL look back on it and be soooooooooooo embarrassed. People do things in WIITWD on an impulse or in trying to prove themselves that may mark them for life.

Or in their wild enthusiasm.. may mark the submissive for life.

We aren't play with Barbi dolls here.. it's actual people. If yo break one, you have to fix them. And if life experience is limited as to people in general..,how would you know if you did mental damage? It's kind of like giving a loaded gun to an unmentionable. When is TOO soon?

Well see the problem with that is, a lot of the submissives don't have enough control over themselves to be submissive. In order to be able to give up control, one must understand oneself and have complete self control. The submissives who aren't in control of their own lives, give up somethign they never had in the first place, those are the ones that get hurt, that have mental damage. Granted it may be the Master's fault, but it is just as much the submissive's fault as well. It is too easy to blame everything on the Master and the poor submissive girl had to bear it all herself.

_____________________________

God is naught but the values that surround him, my honor is the only deity I will give lip service

(in reply to LotusSong)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 1:14:56 PM

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DevilsVendetta

My issue is this: Can you get started TOO early in all this and mess up your mind for any future relationships? For example- people into Goth. They WILL look back on it and be soooooooooooo embarrassed. People do things in WIITWD on an impulse or in trying to prove themselves that may mark them for life.

Or in their wild enthusiasm.. may mark the submissive for life.

We aren't play with Barbi dolls here.. it's actual people. If yo break one, you have to fix them. And if life experience is limited as to people in general..,how would you know if you did mental damage? It's kind of like giving a loaded gun to an unmentionable. When is TOO soon?

Well see the problem with that is, a lot of the submissives don't have enough control over themselves to be submissive. In order to be able to give up control, one must understand oneself and have complete self control. The submissives who aren't in control of their own lives, give up somethign they never had in the first place, those are the ones that get hurt, that have mental damage. Granted it may be the Master's fault, but it is just as much the submissive's fault as well. It is too easy to blame everything on the Master and the poor submissive girl had to bear it all herself.

I agree. This is the crux of it all. No one really knows when they are "ready" until they hit a wall. The dominant party is the one holding the reigns and they do need to be the one accountable. It's not something were one can say "oh, my bad. Laters".

You have to know how to read people. And some people never learn.. but how you learn that is by life experience in different venues.

The submissive that comes to you and says.. "I'll do anything for you" probably doesn't have a realistic concept of what "anything"can mean, thus expecting YOU (collective 'you' here. not Personal) to know what she/he wants.

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to DevilsVendetta)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 1:17:11 PM

Posts: 655
Joined: 2/8/2005
Status: offline

I know an early 50's goth - he likes Goth/industrial and was on the start of the curve in New Wave days. I think he dressses great, though it's not my personal sartorial choice. He's also much more up on music and art than most people are, at the risk of being accused of not acting his age. There are still hippies who are hippies from back then, while it may be for others to make fun of them, they don't seem to care and most have enough grace to laugh at themselves, too.

I agree it's easy and common for people to get whole-hog into "this" before they are ready. A lot of them are middle aged and will NEVER be ready, without a whole mess of therapy that they're not doing. There is no court or regulatory body for proclaiming people mature or competent at life, and fortunately, there's space for people to grow and mature together and change as a unit. In 4 years my husband and I have done a lot of growth and change, made mistakes D/s and otherwise and happily still seem to be pulling the same sled without any bodies littering the path.

I get what you're saying though, and I agree to an extent - while there are the occasional highly mature 20 or 21 year olds out there way beyond many 40 year olds in judgement and ability - hello, they're rare. They're also not the ones saying "I'm mature and I know myself totally well, I'm ready for anything" THAT is a red flag.

My issue is this: Can you get started TOO early in all this and mess up your mind for any future relationships? For example- people into Goth. They WILL look back on it and be soooooooooooo embarrassed. People do things in WIITWD on an impulse or in trying to prove themselves that may mark them for life.

Or in their wild enthusiasm.. may mark the submissive for life.

We aren't play with Barbi dolls here.. it's actual people. If yo break one, you have to fix them. And if life experience is limited as to people in general..,how would you know if you did mental damage? It's kind of like giving a loaded gun to an unmentionable. When is TOO soon?
[/quote]

(in reply to LotusSong)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 1:28:24 PM

Posts: 3403
Joined: 8/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

Was it that you have had alot of exposure to just online Goreans that RP or have you ever truly known a Gorean that practices the lifestyle RT and upholds the philosophies of Gor?

Bloody hell having to go fish up the context for this to explain.

While I appreciate your offer, I've been approached by Gor doms more times than I can count trying to "cure me" of this dominant streak I possess...without success. Much to the dismay of one that's sought repeatedly to make me his own, the days of prostrating myself for anyone especially those concerned with someone elses version of "the right way" will come after I'm dead. I've had hours of conversations ad nauseum discussing how high protocol gor would help me so much with my life only to have to explain weeks later to this same dominant why his girls told him to piss up a rope and left.

_____________________________

Finding a good sub is like sifting through trail mix. You find a few fruits, a lotta nuts and have to sift to get to the sweet and special ones
drama llama

(in reply to Grlwithboy)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 2:07:57 PM

Posts: 3403
Joined: 8/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

I was never good as a teenager, in vanilla relationships. Im not very good at them to this day even with friends. I never knew why, as teenager, i had such problem with girls in school. It seemed like they wanted more and more control and i felt as if they had to approve of everything i did. The problem was i dont mesh well with vanilla girls. I have to have a majority of the control in a relationship and ive been that way since my teenage years.

So this lifestyle, looked like something that suited me, at that age. i could have my control and i wouldnt have to fight the girl involved for it if she was a sub. she would happily give up the control i needed. after that i never looked back.

So for me it was natural, and its been a damn long journey to this point. But ive learned much and learned thier is much yet to learn. To be a master is to learn you can never be a "master", as that is a title none of us would live long enough to achieve imvo . but we still use that word loosely:P

as for other teenage "doms", i think for some alot of of the appeal is " these doms can get girls to do whatever they want. i could get my dick sucked all day long if i was a dom!!!!! by lots of different girls and they wouldnt complain!!" ...... If only they knew the work it takes to get to the point they see that impresses them so much and seems so appealing. I do think some are naturally Dom and stumble upon this. I mean when your a teenager fresh out of highschool how much do you really know about sex? you know what hole to put it in and if you can get it in the other two you gotta hellva girl. you know sex caused you and condoms are damn expensive on min wage for something you can only use 1 time.

Here is the full context from which my comment came. He claims to have learned this philosophy from Gor chat rooms.

As one that has spent time in Gor rooms run by friends the idea that ALL women are subservient and should prostrate themselves goes against my grain. I've been assumed to be the free companion of my friend and after quite some time finally got him to quit referring to me as his property (I voluntarily spent time with him but was in no way shape or form in his service or submitted to him).
I found it very interesting that his girls would come in claim to be slaves worth of silks much higher than their attitudes would make one think. As master decided they'd be started as a beginner no matter what, usually with a battle. Battles would turn to willful disobedience, disobedience to crying on the shoulder of another master that would then attempt to "kill" their master (well known assasin himself) to claim their prize. Their master would find out about this and usually dump them squarely (usually after having invested a great deal of real money into expensive collars, education and classes for them). I've had "masters" try to force collar me and have seen more than my share of drama with people quoting this line or that from the books to justify their poor behavior.

So to wrap up and put this all in context.

quote:

i could have my control and i wouldnt have to fight the girl involved for it if she was a sub. she would happily give up the control i needed.
Further reading the Gor perspective expains a lot. I WAS going to ask where these amazing creatures that prostrate themselves at the sight of a dominant dewll until I realized it was with the unicorns and faries.

In the context listed above these amazing women that immediately prostrate themselves to any dominant that shows up don't exsist except in books. Even the Gor masters I'm aquainted with would punish their girls for serving anyone that they had not conferred precidence upon.

_____________________________

Finding a good sub is like sifting through trail mix. You find a few fruits, a lotta nuts and have to sift to get to the sweet and special ones
drama llama

(in reply to theRose4U)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 2:10:55 PM

Posts: 1793
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Watford / London
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: DevilsVendetta

Alright. Well since most "teen masters" never read the boards lol, I guess I'll sit here and defend them, well... maybe not the vast majority of totally incompetent ones.

Firstly, I'd like to say, all the negative aspects most people see in teen Doms, can often be seen in people 25-55. Often enough I've stumbled on profiles of middle aged men who obviously just wanted an excuse to get laid and take advantage of some poor stupid 19 year old girl. The negative aspects we can see in Doms has no age barrier, there are plenty of inexperienced, think-theyre-god Doms who are 40.

Now, back on the subject. How could I possibly think I'm a competent master at 19. Perhaps, we must all begin learning this somewhere. I've been interested in this lifestyle for a few years now, and have experienced it myself to some degree. I don't claim to know everything and be able to write books on the subject. Now, if we all didnt perpetuate this whole "young Doms cannot possibly know a thing" PERHAPS, we'd have less idiots on this site. Simple as this, is these Doms are consistantly getting bashed and flamed, they see no reason to stay. So what we're left with is all these idiots. I think many people on this site so easily portray the Domlier-than-thou attitude which just makes me laugh. This is a website. What are you trying to prove, I could just as easily be the 40 year old master with years of experience... your e-ego doesn't impress me.

So how about, for once, we chill out on the younger Doms and let them live it out and learn. Experience isn't everythign my friend, I'm sure theres some idiots on this site who could easy be put to shame by someone under 20. I rarely post on the boards, but I do like to observe, and some of you just crack me up. Some of you are simply little boys on a power trip who happen to be old enough to grow a beard.

Now I know this doesn't apply to all of you, but it does to a very large number. So now I await your hurt little e-egos, get your panties up in a bunch and flame me. I welcome it.

My issue is this: Can you get started TOO early in all this and mess up your mind for any future relationships? For example- people into Goth. They WILL look back on it and be soooooooooooo embarrassed. People do things in WIITWD on an impulse or in trying to prove themselves that may mark them for life.

Or in their wild enthusiasm.. may mark the submissive for life.

We aren't play with Barbi dolls here.. it's actual people. If yo break one, you have to fix them. And if life experience is limited as to people in general..,how would you know if you did mental damage? It's kind of like giving a loaded gun to an unmentionable. When is TOO soon?

I can't comment for everyone however I can say.... I have been submissive as long as I have known, I also grew up very very early dun to some things that had happened I had to.
I am 24 years old and I have been practicing the lifestyle for 8 years, and working out my inner feelings and thoughts in regards to the lifestyle for two years before that, I am mentally stable, smart, thoughtful, responsible and honest, I have a deep sense of right and wrong and strong morals and ethics, I hold down a steady job that pays well and I have been doing it several years now and no, I do not regret starting my journey that young, I did not jump into it and it was not an impulse, nor do I see myself growing out of it or being "sooooo embaressed"
Then again, I have also been what is classed as a "goth" since the age of 9 and sufice to say if it is a phase and one that I will be "sooo embaressed" by, well it's a pretty long one.

(in reply to LotusSong)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/21/2006 2:25:46 PM

Posts: 3403
Joined: 8/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

I truly wish to know so that I can better understand and educate on both sides of what seems to me as a ridiculous war between lifestyles

Not quite sure what you want to know. Female dominants don't like being called girl and asked to serve just because they're female. They are highly likely to become volatile when newbie dom tries to make his first force collar because she tells him no, not in this life, not interested in your collar. Worse is when she replies to the question of "who is your master you're in big trouble" with "I'm in charge of me and don't recognize you as a power in my life".
Male subs don't like it because they are viewed as less than dirt, the lowest of the low and "bitch" to anyone. Their ownership is also not respected because of this status some book conveys should be so.

quote:

I believe much of this war can be done away with if we stop making generalized derogatory comments and better understand each other. Understanding does not mean agreeing with.

Nice theory, please feel free to share with me when the choices I've made for my life and those that belong to me become respected in your realm. In the mean time your rules don't work for my kink.
I respect my friends that choose that life and have a relationship where I can freely express to them how they are missing the signals their slaves are giving and they freely tell me to piss off. I freely tell them I told ya so when they get tossed aside and they freely mock my boy's service style. Basically we exsist with Gor's their thing, and they can keep it.

_____________________________

Finding a good sub is like sifting through trail mix. You find a few fruits, a lotta nuts and have to sift to get to the sweet and special ones
drama llama

(in reply to theRose4U)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/22/2006 5:24:02 AM

Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline

Greetings theRose4U,

I am not interested in curing you, if you are Dominant, then so be it. I was just asking to better understand why you felt that way. Also, I was not approaching you, I was just asking to better understand why you felt the way you did. Gor is not for everyone, I recognize this and feel it is always best to follow one's self.

I have seen the same reaction on the Gor side, and also question them as to why they feel as they do towards BDSM. I am pretty straight forward, and many people do not see that, so I often get the same reactions. They believe their must be alterior motives when there are none. Anyway, I leave you to what you wish to learn and know. Your response has given me a little information at least.

Orion

quote:

ORIGINAL: theRose4U

quote:

Was it that you have had alot of exposure to just online Goreans that RP or have you ever truly known a Gorean that practices the lifestyle RT and upholds the philosophies of Gor?

Bloody hell having to go fish up the context for this to explain.

While I appreciate your offer, I've been approached by Gor doms more times than I can count trying to "cure me" of this dominant streak I possess...without success. Much to the dismay of one that's sought repeatedly to make me his own, the days of prostrating myself for anyone especially those concerned with someone elses version of "the right way" will come after I'm dead. I've had hours of conversations ad nauseum discussing how high protocol gor would help me so much with my life only to have to explain weeks later to this same dominant why his girls told him to piss up a rope and left.

(in reply to theRose4U)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/22/2006 5:59:22 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DevilsVendetta

Well see the problem with that is, a lot of the submissives don't have enough control over themselves to be submissive. In order to be able to give up control, one must understand oneself and have complete self control. The submissives who aren't in control of their own lives, give up somethign they never had in the first place, those are the ones that get hurt, that have mental damage.

This is one of those meaningless phrases that fail the test of reality. First of all, you're equating poor outcomes with lack of control and that's incorrect. I have complete control over my garden, but I'm not a very good gardener. Consequently, my house has some shrubbery, trees and bushes, and a few select rose bushes while my neighbors have daffodils, magnolias, daisies, and a whole lotta nice looking flowers that I don't know the name of and that I kill (unintentionally) within three weeks every time I try to plant them.

The point is, I have complete control of my garden, same as my neighbors do. But I'm just not as good of a gardener as they are, and our outcomes are (obviously) not the same.

Back to the issue of submissives and control. Some may not be as adept at various issues pertaining to life, and so the outcome of their control may be (relatively) below the norm. The same can be said for various aspects of Dominant's lives (my gardening is a glaring neighborhood example). But in each instance, whether submissive or Dominant, unless already engaged in a power exchange relationship they have complete control over their lives.

Some "flowery" theories about the nature of submissives or Dominants may appeal on a superficial level. But almost invariably, they fail any test of logic, observation and common sense.

John

< Message edited by Rover -- 12/22/2006 6:02:13 AM >

_____________________________

"Man's mind stretched to a new idea never goes back to its original dimensions."

Sri da Avabhas

(in reply to DevilsVendetta)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/22/2006 11:39:48 AM

Posts: 655
Joined: 2/8/2005
Status: offline

Indeed! If we give ourselves the "totally fully functioning adult" examination honestly, let's admit that not all us D's are always passing this one with flying colors. If "issues" are always a disqualifier from D/s none of us would be doing it.

I have made mistakes that I can chalk up to being under 30, and I'm sure I'm making mistakes now that I can chalk up to being under 40 later. I don't see why people aren't willing to give a younger Dom the benefit of the doubt -- OR hold Dom Master Lord Bleeding Axe of the 13th Realm (age 45) up to the exact same standards of disbelief and scruitiny we do newDom21.

(in reply to Rover)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/22/2006 4:11:31 PM

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

Wow...interesting thread. Well, finnally at least there is a topic I feal 100% in posting about! I'll let the *grown ups* (coughs) continue their discussion while I try and answer the question posed. I am 23 year olds and a dominant. I currently have a submissive and am active in the local BDSM communities. I dont consider or disillusion to myself into thinking I am experienced, but I consider myself to be very well educated. I do not call myself Master Rabbit or Sir Rabbit or anything like that.

Now personally, I dont measure dominance in age, but rather in maturity. Dominance begins at the heart, a desire to own someone, to be in control. There is no age requirement to have these desires, but BEING a dominant isnt that simple Because of that, I happen to have contempt for most of the dominants I meet my age who clearly lack the character, maturity, self control, and structure to be a dominant figure in someone's life. I sadly have to say I have met none that I trully relate with who understand there is more to being a dominant or a Master than having someone around to say "Suck it bitch!" to.

Now I am different because I have been on my own since roughly the age of 16 and have quite a few life experiences (a few too many), but even though I consider myself to be a mature adult, I dont dillusion myself into thinking that I am at a point in my life where I can have a slave and have complete control over someone else's life. I have schooling to finish, a steady career to build, and a completely stabled and structured life to put together first. My girl and I have a D/S relationship not an M/S relationship.

I judge every dominant I meet by their character, maturity and knowledge and hold them to the same high standards I try to hold myself to. So all these young guys online calling themselves "Master Sadism" or whatever are no different to me then all these old guys calling themselves "Grand Master Rick" when they have no merit.

I have no time for anyone who wishes to condescend to me, look down at me, or expects me to lick and clean their boots because they are more "experienced" than I am. I know what I can do, I admit what I cannot do, I admit my noviceness, and am going to take zero shit about it. My mentors are all extermely high quality and knowledgable people who treat me as an equal and respect me because of this. Experience comes with time and trying. I may be a novice, but I have yet to injure or harm my girl in any one of our scenes. Why? Because I took the time to read, talk to people, practice, and educate myself.

Now on the subject of calling yourself Master, I think there is two definitions.

One is you are the Master of a slave. For this, there is no age requirement. If you have someone who wishes to give up that much power to you and consentually make you their Master, then you are a Master....TO THEM. Dont expect me to call you Master.

The other is a master of a particular toy. Realistically, the odds of a person my age mastering a whip or something of the sort is slim to none.

Personally, I look at Master as not a title, but an ideal. Something you strive to become. Its a persona, a mindset, something you grow, change, and transform into.

Then finnally, these is a third definition which is what you see mostly on the Internet. The slap-your-own-ass, self proclaimed disillusion of self importance. Anyone can hop on online and give themselves a Master title! There is no age requirment for that. And in my experiences, the majority of the people online with that self proclaimed title have absolutely zero "Master" persona and that incluides people who are 19 and people who are 44.

In conclusion, the BDSM community (and the world) would be a whole lot better off if they stop looking at age and start looking at what really makes a dominant a dominant and a Master a Master....character, maturity, and expertise. Relative expertise at least. I dont consider myself an expert flogger, but I have taken time to have my mentor teach me the strokes, show me where to hit and not to hit, study anatomy so I know the consequences of inaccuracy, and practice on a pilllow. My age had nothing to do with any of that.

Oh, and while my experience has been called into question many times, my dominance has not.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 12/22/2006 4:37:05 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Grlwithboy)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/22/2006 5:11:27 PM

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: DevilsVendetta

Alright. Well since most "teen masters" never read the boards lol, I guess I'll sit here and defend them, well... maybe not the vast majority of totally incompetent ones.

Firstly, I'd like to say, all the negative aspects most people see in teen Doms, can often be seen in people 25-55. Often enough I've stumbled on profiles of middle aged men who obviously just wanted an excuse to get laid and take advantage of some poor stupid 19 year old girl. The negative aspects we can see in Doms has no age barrier, there are plenty of inexperienced, think-theyre-god Doms who are 40.

Now, back on the subject. How could I possibly think I'm a competent master at 19. Perhaps, we must all begin learning this somewhere. I've been interested in this lifestyle for a few years now, and have experienced it myself to some degree. I don't claim to know everything and be able to write books on the subject. Now, if we all didnt perpetuate this whole "young Doms cannot possibly know a thing" PERHAPS, we'd have less idiots on this site. Simple as this, is these Doms are consistantly getting bashed and flamed, they see no reason to stay. So what we're left with is all these idiots. I think many people on this site so easily portray the Domlier-than-thou attitude which just makes me laugh. This is a website. What are you trying to prove, I could just as easily be the 40 year old master with years of experience... your e-ego doesn't impress me.

So how about, for once, we chill out on the younger Doms and let them live it out and learn. Experience isn't everythign my friend, I'm sure theres some idiots on this site who could easy be put to shame by someone under 20. I rarely post on the boards, but I do like to observe, and some of you just crack me up. Some of you are simply little boys on a power trip who happen to be old enough to grow a beard.

Now I know this doesn't apply to all of you, but it does to a very large number. So now I await your hurt little e-egos, get your panties up in a bunch and flame me. I welcome it.

My issue is this: Can you get started TOO early in all this and mess up your mind for any future relationships? For example- people into Goth. They WILL look back on it and be soooooooooooo embarrassed. People do things in WIITWD on an impulse or in trying to prove themselves that may mark them for life.

Or in their wild enthusiasm.. may mark the submissive for life.

We aren't play with Barbi dolls here.. it's actual people. If yo break one, you have to fix them. And if life experience is limited as to people in general..,how would you know if you did mental damage? It's kind of like giving a loaded gun to an unmentionable. When is TOO soon?

That isnt a question of a age, but a question of maturity. The immaturity of a person is what defines someone as too soon. And ultimately, immaturity plays only a part in that. Ethics are even more a part. There is plenty of 40 year old doms on collarme.com who have caused quite a lot of mental damage to submissives, not because of their immaturity, but because of their general complete lack of ethics.
The college frat boys with a bottle of roofies cause emotional and mental trauma to young girls not because of their age or their maturity, but because of their ethics.

And when it comes to immaturity, most people think age and maturity are linked, but I disagree. Age just happens. Maturity and wisdom require effort.

My point is...its not about age. A 40 year old troll with ethics and integrity that equate to that of the average child molestor will cause the same emotional and mental damage as a 22 year old college frat boy with the roofies.

To find out if someone should or should not be a dominant, you have to examine their character and maturity, and not their age.

And regardless, you are asking "What if" questions that really have no answer. The simple truth is whether your 40 and getting started in this or 23, you are going to make mistakes and fuck up. What makes a difference is intent, whether or not you are going to own up to the consequences of those mistakes, and whether or not you are going to learn from those mistakes. And those things... *drum roll*..come with being mature. Ultimately, maturity is taking responsibility for yourself and for others and that is what dominance is more or less.

It is possible that I can cause some kind of mental damage to my submissive with my actions, but I CARE about it. That is why I listen to my gut and concious, try to put aside my ego and be self aware, and have mentors we both can talk to if we think something is wrong.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 12/22/2006 5:17:30 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to LotusSong)

RE: Teenish Masters - 12/22/2006 8:14:35 PM

Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: theRose4U

Nice theory, please feel free to share with me when the choices I've made for my life and those that belong to me become respected in your realm. In the mean time your rules don't work for my kink.
I respect my friends that choose that life and have a relationship where I can freely express to them how they are missing the signals their slaves are giving and they freely tell me to piss off. I freely tell them I told ya so when they get tossed aside and they freely mock my boy's service style. Basically we exsist with Gor's their thing, and they can keep it.

Yeah I am familiar with the BDSM lifestyle, having been involved with it for 13 years prior to leaving that community. Just write me off as one of those RPing Goreans and I will just write you off as just another Domme that has to be bitchy to prove her dominance. I doubt neither will be correct but we would never want to try the theory I proposed now would we.

Orion

(in reply to theRose4U)

RE: Teenish Masters - 3/25/2007 7:57:09 PM

Posts: 3
Joined: 3/2/2007
Status: offline

Well, I'm intrigued by these 2 18 year old Dommes. They are both quite beautiful and what seems experienced! I'd be more than happy to submit to one or both of these young ladies!!!

(in reply to theRose4U)

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