RE: Master why do you want to share me?

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RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:13:13 PM

Posts: 3460
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

This is about a dynamic where the needs of the owner do not cause the property to struggle or sacrifice or feel her life is a trial. They are -his- needs. Last time I checked he didn't have to alter his needs so she can share space up on the cross. If her lot in life is an easy one and she wants a sucky one, seriously those are the breaks.

I have already answered that. I cant prepare for every little contigency and I stated I wont dump a slave just because I didnt get any additional value because everything was easy for me.

I want to win the lottery. Winning the lottery would provide additional bonus and fulfillment in my life.

Just because I dont win the lottery doesnt necessarily mean I wont have a fulfilling life.

I might have a life thats NOT as fulfilling as life where I won the lottery. But thats how life throws curve balls at us.

I would like an ice cream cone tonight. Just because I dont have one doesnt mean I wont have a good night. The ice cream cone would add some value to the night though.

I have said over and over again that I find additional value in acts of suffering, not that I dont find value in what my slave does for me without it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie
What does someone who quits have to do with this? We are talking about a couple where he doesn't ask anything that is a hardship to her and if he asked something difficult of her she wouldn't request space up on the cross she'd just do it and not look to be cannonized for it. Sacrifice, hardship, trial, are all matters of perception. I choose to not look at life that way.

Because the whole purpose of why people value things that are harder is because they devalue people who quit because its hard. Its how we establish credit.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:14:31 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: daddysprop247

quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie
We are not talking about "any" service he could possibly or may ever demand, we are talking about things he has asked of her either in past or presently happening that she does not feel are a sacrifice or a trial for her.

OK so your owner has you do thing that make you suffer, they effect -your- mindset and growth as a slave, but they are not a requirement for slavery or growth in an M/s dyanmic which is what you said earlier prop.

requirement for slavery? no. requirement for growth? imo, yes. however this is all my lil old opinion, based on my own perceptions and understanding of ownership and slavery. with those who have a different understanding of the concepts, the same truth would not apply. and actually, for the sake of curiousity and learning about ways which differ from my own, i'd be curious to know just what sorts of things help foster growth and symbolize ownership in dynamics where there are never any trials for a slave to overcome.

I just gave you some, she learns to cook gourmet meals, she becomes knowledgeable about wine to share his passion for same, she goes back to school earns her Master's or Doctorial degree in a field she always wanted to get into but didn't think she was good enough too be in, she learns investing when she never thought she could and makes a fortune, she learns to sew whole outfits when she couldn't sew a button when she came into the dynamic. She starts an ebay business from the ground up and in several months becomes a gold powerseller and brings him over $5k in profit a month when a year before she didn't know how to turn on the computer. She learns to paint, writes and publishes her first novel or a novel for him...all of these things being possible because of the dynamic and the environment he provides..strengthening her bond with him. I admit I don't understand this idea that growth can only come in an M/s dynamic from things a person dislikes or finds bad or makes then unhappy. It is truly unfounded. If they want it too, they better find a partner who will supply it, if they are owned and he won't make them a martyr, that is kind of too bad. Perhaps they will get to suffer in away that isn't quite so satisfying to them...hmmm.

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to daddysprop247)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:24:23 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

I admit I don't understand this idea that growth can only come in an M/s dynamic from things a person dislikes or finds bad or makes then unhappy.

Because its not in the disliking or bad or unhappy.

The value I find in the suffering isnt because of the suffering itself, but the suffering and hardship they endured to meet the challenge.

If I found value in purposeless suffering, then I could go kill ants with a maginifying glass.

Pushing ourselves to become better and meet challenges IS essential to growth in my opinion.

Lets say I had a video game that had three different levels of difficulty.

If I just played at easy all the time, I wont get any better at the game.

So I move up a level and go threw getting my ass kicked, failing at completeling levels and continue to push myself and suffer and endure to get better.

When I get to the last difficulty level and complete it, my skills have advanced and I have found more pride and sense of accomplishment in those skills because of what I endured to get there.

If the task is particularly difficult and harder, then I find more value in the obedience of that task because to accomplish obeying, they had to go threw more to get there.

It provides additional value for me because of the hardship they went threw to make the accomplishment.

This is not to say that I wont find value in the accomplishment if it isnt as hard or I have to constantly go threw life with my dynamic, living in the extreme examples you have provided, and coming up with new harder tasks for me to find value in my slave.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 7/19/2007 1:26:35 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:25:03 PM

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Because he wants to.

_____________________________

Regards,
Cumulus

(in reply to mine2share)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:26:02 PM

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We are not even talking about the same things. Honestly I don't have any idea what you talking about. This isn't about what value any of this has, it is about whether or not it has to happen for a person to be a slave or for there to be growth in the dynamic. If you place value on it you will do it in your dynamic. If you make your property do things -you- wouldn't want done just to cause her to suffer so you feel more fufilled as a person, I'd say that is odd and silly but seriously that an $3.50 will get you a cup of coffee.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

I have already answered that. I cant prepare for every little contigency and I stated I wont dump a slave just because I didnt get any additional value because everything was easy for me.

I want to win the lottery. Winning the lottery would provide additional bonus and fulfillment in my life.

Just because I dont win the lottery doesnt necessarily mean I wont have a fulfilling life.

I might have a life thats NOT as fulfilling as life where I won the lottery. But thats how life throws curve balls at us.

I would like an ice cream cone tonight. Just because I dont have one doesnt mean I wont have a good night. The ice cream cone would add some value to the night though.

I have said over and over again that I find additional value in acts of suffering, not that I dont find value in what my slave does for me without it.

quote:

Because the whole purpose of why people value things that are harder is because they devalue people who quit because its hard. Its how we establish credit.

Uhh OK but nobody is quitting, the person is doing what they are told, they are being asked to do what the owner wants them to do... What is the problem for either party?

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to MadRabbit)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:29:20 PM

Posts: 1712
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From: DC Metro area
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

I admit I don't understand this idea that growth can only come in an M/s dynamic from things a person dislikes or finds bad or makes then unhappy.

Because its not in the disliking or bad or unhappy.

The value I find in the suffering isnt because of the suffering itself, but the suffering and hardship they endured to meet the challenge.

If I found value in purposeless suffering, then I could go kill ants with a maginifying glass.

Pushing ourselves to become better and meet challenges IS essential to growth in my opinion.

Lets say I had a video game that had three different levels of difficulty.

If I just played at easy all the time, I wont get any better at the game.

So I move up a level and go threw getting my ass kicked, failing at completeling levels and continue to push myself and suffer and endure to get better.

When I get to the last difficulty level and complete it, my skills have advanced and I have found more pride and sense of accomplishment in those skills because of what I endured to get there.

If the task is particularly difficult and harder, then I find more value in the obedience of that task because to accomplish obeying, they had to go threw more to get there.

It provides additional value for me because of the hardship they went threw to make the accomplishment.

This is not to say that I wont find value in the accomplishment if it isnt as hard or I have to constantly go threw life with my dynamic, living in the extreme examples you have provided, and coming up with new harder tasks for me to find value in my slave.

dang...all i can say, is "ditto." lol

(in reply to MadRabbit)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:29:57 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

If you make your property do things -you- wouldn't want done just to cause her to suffer so you feel more fufilled as a person, I'd say that is odd and silly.

Lol. Well I guess thats why we dont understand each other. I guess we just cant comprehend each others views on this. I guess thats why I am on the defensive here because I have someone who has the assumption that I am some cruel and abusive sadist.

Please find anywhere in my posts where I said that.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:38:48 PM

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Joined: 10/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

I admit I don't understand this idea that growth can only come in an M/s dynamic from things a person dislikes or finds bad or makes then unhappy.

Because its not in the disliking or bad or unhappy.

OK but for prop it is about being made to do things she doesn't like or want to do and her implication that if it isn't hard for the girl to handle or makes her suffer that she won't grow from it. I'm sorry I'm trying to stick with props posts. Being made to learn gourmet cooking when she really wants to anyway wouldn't do it for her even if it was challenging for her..nor do I think would getting her master's in a field she had always wanted to work in. Yet those things cause growth and a tightening and deepening of the M/s bond. The possibilities are endless and none *require* the girl to dislike or struggle with obedience to the task but they can still challenge her.

< Message edited by BeingChewsie -- 7/19/2007 1:48:49 PM >

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to MadRabbit)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:40:37 PM

Posts: 4470
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From: Cold and magickal Norway in a town near Bergen!
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Hi

And yet to spend time whit them, to maintein a relationship, to have them in your life, that is a sacrefice, it may be one that one do whit a happy hearth, but it is time and resoures that could have been spent on something else.

i love my mother, and nothing i do to keep her in my life is as much a sacrefice as what i get from being whit her, however money to travel to her is a sacrefice, time and efforet to travel, to smile and not argue when she have her unreasonable moments, all this are sacrefice. In all human relationship i have seen, there is sacrefice done by the pepole in the relationship to make it work.

i wish you well

_____________________________

Whatever you think you can do or believe you can do, begin it. Action has magic, grace and power in it.--Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Futon torpedoes, make love not war!--Aswad

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:43:08 PM

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You're confusing "having someone in my life" with "having an ongoing relationship with someone."

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to nephandi)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:46:13 PM

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Uh. Let me clear this up for you. I don't believe property can be abused so you being or not being a sadist would never involve the words abusive from me. You'd never hear those words uttered from my lips.

In fact what did ANY of this discussion have to do with sadism? This is about a slave saying that to be a slave(which has nothing to to with sadism and masochism) ones needs to be put through trials and sacrifices by the owner that they don't like or it isn't growth. Maybe that will help clear this up.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

If you make your property do things -you- wouldn't want done just to cause her to suffer so you feel more fufilled as a person, I'd say that is odd and silly.

Lol. Well I guess thats why we dont understand each other. I guess we just cant comprehend each others views on this. I guess thats why I am on the defensive here because I have someone who has the assumption that I am some cruel and abusive sadist.

Please find anywhere in my posts where I said that.

< Message edited by BeingChewsie -- 7/19/2007 1:47:08 PM >

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to MadRabbit)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:49:19 PM

Posts: 4470
Joined: 9/23/2005
From: Cold and magickal Norway in a town near Bergen!
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Hi

Ok this is a reply to the general tread.

How i userstand MadRabbit is that it is a bit like whit okkult initiations. In one Wiccan tradition for exsample the candiate is required to sit in the forest, alone, naked all night along, this is done to face one self and to face ones fears. It is a terrifying ritual mean to test the comitment of the candidate. Before and after this ritual the candidate is required to donate allot of his or her time to study, to assist the older members of the Coven and generally learn the craft and be useful. When a teatcher send his student out in the forest or say ok, either you take the time to to study or you get lost, yes that may mean you have to get a cheaper apaerment so you can work less and study more, he do not do this out of some sadistic glee, he do it to both test the candidtate, to see if he or she is willing to do what it takes, he is also more inportantly doing it to show the candidate that this is not a dance on roses, much must be given of to be a member of this Coven. Also once the candidate pass the tests, have faced theese hardships it make his or her relationship whit the Coven stronger, more deeply felt.

i think perhaps that is what it is here, one is showing the slave that she is owned by having her face hardships, another is to show her that she is sacrifing and have to continue doing so to walk this path. i may be wrong, but that is how i see it.

i wish you well

_____________________________

Whatever you think you can do or believe you can do, begin it. Action has magic, grace and power in it.--Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Futon torpedoes, make love not war!--Aswad

(in reply to MadRabbit)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:55:50 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

Being made to learn goumet cooking when she really wants too anyway wouldn't do it for her even if it was challaneging for her..nor do I think would getting her master's in a field she had always wanted to work in.

I wont speak for Prop on this, but only for myself.

Sure, thats very true. And I am not excluding those things.

If she were to learn gourmet cooking and she wanted to do it for me, then that would be great and fulfilling. The pleasure and fulfillment I would find in the suffering would be in the trials she would encounter as she learned and progressed. The burning of cakes, the frustration of just NOT being able to get a certain dish right, the cuts and burns that come with mistakes with open flame or a knife.

I have spent a good chunk of my life learning how to cook in professional kitchens. I wanted to do it. However, the process of learning presented many trials, hardships, and acts of suffering.

I would find fullfillment in watching her suffer and move past each trial the process presented. However, the fullfillment wont be solely from the suffering, but the growth the suffering presented.

I beleive suffering is a valuable part of life. I welcome it. Cherish it. Enjoy it. Each hardship life throws at me, each trial I overcome, each negative experience, I become a stronger and better person.

I think suffering is important. Without pain and suffering, there wont be any strength.

Now...if I had a slave who already was an expert at gourmet cooking, thats fine. I would still be equally happy with them as a person. I just would miss out on my own enjoyment and fullfillment of watching them grow and overcome hardship to get better at that skill.

I certainly would not make them completely relearn gourmet cooking just because of my own personal fulfillment in watching someone grow and prosper. That would be silly.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:57:52 PM

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

Uh. Let me clear this up for you. I don't believe property can be abused so you being or not being a sadist would never involve the words abusive from me. You'd never hear those words uttered from my lips.

In fact what did ANY of this discussion have to do with sadism? This is about a slave saying that to be a slave(which has nothing to to with sadism and masochism) ones needs to be put through trials and sacrifices by the owner that they don't like or it isn't growth. Maybe that will help clear this up.

Thank you. That was how I was taking your words.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 1:58:02 PM

Aswad

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Now...we had a relationship for an entire year. All that encompassed that relationship was blowjobs, doing laundry and getting coffee. These were solely the activities that she had to do and obey with. Don't forget the vacuuming, cleaning and footlicking too. I want that too.

You get all of this at your office?
Any job openings perchance?
I'll even pass on the coffee.
(j/k)

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 2:13:06 PM

Aswad

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Thank you Aswad. This is actually a better description of what I am saying.

YW. Glad I could help. Been feeling like I'm stumbling over the words lately.

quote:

Testing and trials was a poor choice of wording. They imply that I am purposefuly testing my girl's submission out of a need for reassurance.

Some actually do that, whether for that reason or others, which I'm not dismissing.
Just saying it isn't my cup of tea, and apparently not yours either.
It wasn't such a poor choice of words, though, they've just become very loaded over time.

quote:

I am implying that I have standards and what I want and I expect over time the slave to conform and mold to them.

~nod~

quote:

Its just the more difficult the standard is, the more depth I feal in the relationship.

A journeys bring people together, and submission/slavery is a journey.
Particularly with a demanding dominant/owner.

Some set out for perfection, and see how far one can get.
Others have a specific destination in mind.

That, and a sub/slave that has been tailored to your wants, needs and desires is one that is "designed" to please you, and one you can attach yourself to more deeply. Plus, that ingrained fear that most people seem to have- the fear of being abandoned by a loved one- becomes more distant the more "entangled" you become. When you are the piece that completes the puzzle, yet also only completes that puzzle, you are inclined to hold on to it, though that sounds more cynical than the concept is in my mind.

quote:

I'm not trying to imply that I am in fact going out of my way to make her life hell solely so I can feal validated.

I don't think anyone thought that, at least not as you put it now.
Your posts have generally been accurate, insightful and sensible.
And I, for one, never got the impression you have that addiction.
(Yes, validation can be an addiction for some, I think; explains a lot.)

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 2:14:51 PM

onmykneesforhim

Posts: 112
Joined: 6/18/2006
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HI!,
Laure, if you ever get to Philly, look me up. I know a Master that likes this naked female platter dinning! And it would only be a small dinner party.
You are cute enough to do this!!
hg

quote:

ORIGINAL: Laure

We are poly, so my point of view may be worthless to most - but I was shared on a regular basis, and came to no harm. Of course, there was a great deal of discussion beforehand, and it's not as if I were a tray of canapes at a dinner party.

(in reply to Laure)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 2:15:08 PM

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Joined: 8/9/2006
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Thank you Aswad. I was beginning to think I was really tripping myself up with my own philosophy on this lol.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Aswad)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 2:17:51 PM

Aswad

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quote:

ORIGINAL: heartfeltsub

By push i mean specifically design a test or trial, to use prop's words a great trial to make the slave suffer in his or her slavery.

Ah. No, I would not intentionally do such a thing for the dominance side of things.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to heartfeltsub)

RE: Master why do you want to share me? - 7/19/2007 3:12:48 PM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
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Perhaps we could phrase this differently, if I understand you correctly:

Overcoming adversity gives a sense of accomplishment and satisfaction.
Doing so together with someone else, gives a shared sense of same.
Helping others overcome adversity offers something similar.
Seeing a loved one overcome adversity induces pride.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

If I want something, I have to go out and earn it and suffer and sweat. The trials provide additional value to ME.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

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