RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you want!, Take 2

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RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 6:39:07 AM

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I think all this chivalry is misrepresented in literature too, in my opinion. I don't know if male submissiveness was around in medieval times for example, even though many records are of chivalry and men serving women. But this is from writers and poets, a very select group of people, more in touch with their creative and feminine site. If you learn more about the "actual knights", like I did during my bachelor of European History, you see that they ressembled more raping soldiers than chivalrous rescuers of princesses.

However, female domination in communities was very present up until the Roman Empire. Even in a cruel city like Sparta, women were in high regard, equal to men, and in times of war maybe even superiour, since they stayed behind and "saved and maintained the village". It is because of Athens though, where women were degraded to house slaves basically (although the man in your signature, Socrates, had one hell of a Femdom wife it seemed), and the Romans thinking Athens to be the city of great culture, and basically stealing that culture, that women got in a downward spiral. The industrial revolution, which required that women also got jobs in factories, was the beginning of the upcoming of women (along with the feminism it brought forth) in my opinion. But OK, enough about my views on relationship dynamics throughout history, since that was not what this topic was about.

I still have a feeling that, over here at least, a Femdom relationship would be conceived by society as that of "a wimp and a bitch".

_____________________________

If they say why, why?
Tell 'em that it's human nature

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 1:35:02 PM

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quote:

I still have a feeling that, over here at least, a Femdom relationship would be conceived by society as that of "a wimp and a bitch".

I would attribute this to The Over-Fetishization of the Dominant Woman.

I am not public about my Female-led relationships and I can guarantee you that no one would consider any relationship I was in to be a wimp and a bitch. The feedback I have gotten was that of a strong man who was confident enough to be with a strong woman.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to gedienstig)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 4:17:56 PM

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Even though that is an interesting thread, in my view at least, this stigmatization is what happens whenever something is deviant of what most people in a society perceive as normal. But of course that type of slander only comes up if you, voluntarily or not, go public about your relationship.

And to answer to your thread, yes I have suffered from the over-fetishization of dominant women, but I would never want a mistress like that 24/7. That over-fetishization mode women could go into, is more of some sort of a "treat" women could give their sub for like half an hour to 2 hours. Some sort of "Thank you", by fulfilling that extreme fantasy for a short time, because your slave has gone above and beyond to make your regular day comfortable, because he rubbed your feet when you had been up on them all day, because he hugged you and gave you a backrub after a horrible day,...

_____________________________

If they say why, why?
Tell 'em that it's human nature

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 6:41:04 PM

PerfectSurrender

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From: Saint Petersburg, Florida, USA
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I don't think that man necessarily needs a D/s relationship because he is weak. I don't think man was ever chivalrous because he was easily manipulated.

I think he needs it because he is too strong, whether by societal dictate or by biology. I think that man is in essence, if you strip the last 100 years of demoralization and propaganda away, actually a brute. I mean nothing degrading in that statement, on the contrary it's a compliment to my gender.

The strong man is in far more need to explore his submissive qualities than is the man who is naturally a "pansy."

Sexuality is the harmless no-brainer way of exploring that, expressing it and using it towards positive ends whereas if you did it in day to day life outside of a private relationship you'd be an ineffectual eunuch of a man.

Natural male aggression and dominance is an asset in the real world, especially in a capitalist society where Machiavelli is a guide to personal anarchy.

This dictate is, however, an albatross in the bedroom that prevents emotional exploration and sensuality. I'm suspect of any man that truly desires a push-over bimbo.

This isn't the case for all submissive men, but I suspect it's the case for a lot of submissive men. I personally think most men could stand some time under a whip.

That's my take.

Cool posts people.

(in reply to gedienstig)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 7:36:07 PM

SlaveSubtoserve

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Joined: 6/21/2006
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More often the not, you hear about the expectations that Dommes have of male subs. Let's turn the tables now and see what kind of responses we get.

What motivates you to be submissive?

Why do you identify yourself that way?

What are you searching for in a Domme?

What are the qualities and attributes that you look for in a Domme?

What is the hardest part of being a male sub?

What kind of challenges do you face when attempting to approach a Domme?

What are you biggest fears when meeting a Domme?

What do you believe to be your best strengths and attributes? And do you feel they are often overlooked?

- LA[/font]
[/quote]

...leave it to LA to submit the thread of the year IMO.....

My motiv derives from lifelong desires/fantasies to submit to the control of a woman who wishes to be my Domme with the mutually agreed objective of pleasing her and her showing clearly her pleasure with such back to me.

I id myself that way because that is the type of relatioship i ideally want and need though honestly the word sub does not really do it for me.

My Domme search aims for a woman i would love just in the vanilla senses of being smart, cute, nice, classy, well educated, etc etc but who happens also to need to be Domme for her own fullfillment and wants to do so with moi.

Qualities searching for in La Domme include being so nice vanilla-wise as described above and Domme-wise being into control, worship, obedience, and having a bondage kink and being an enthusiastic non-squishy sadist.

Hardest part of being a male sub is that the women who i absolutely crave to sub to tend to turn out to be subs themselves and wish for me to Dom them, and the women who approach me to be their sub, for some reason i find myself not attracted to.... no click for good reasons actually.

Challenges in approaching Dommes are primarily that in public play spaces there is a bit too much buzz around the whole thing and i find it unnatural to say the least ie lots of male subs hovering over Les Dommes etc.

Having met and known Dommes most of my life, i do not feel any fears per se when meeting them but rather just experience the normal little voice in my head saying....i wonder what she is like, wonder if we will get along, wonder if we will be mutually attracted= just like a vanilla meet i guess.

My best attributes according to others are that i genuinely get a rush from pleasing and seeing that look in her eyes.....that i am normal guy AND sub.....my intelligence and people skills,,,,,.but i also have that nasty sub trait that is often under the radar in F/m world of being fickle too ... ...good male subs are in fact just as picky as any Domme actually out there...its just not as evident due to all the chatter re bad ratios of F - m. Actually my best traits are only overlooked in my experience by Dommes who are not a match anyways and are telescoped pretty sharply by complementary Dommes quite well i have found.

...wow that felt great to articulate this issue..thanx again LA for great post!

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 7:48:38 PM

SlaveSubtoserve

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Joined: 6/21/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha

This is a great thread! If subs are reading this and want to respond but feel that there are too many questions and it would take too long, maybe just answer one or two of them.

Akasha

Quite right. Though they'll get cookies for answering them all ;-)

- LA

ok LA.....how do i get my cookies and what kind will they be= Les Habitants cream cookies perhaps??!!

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 9:16:47 PM

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Joined: 7/4/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PerfectSurrender

I don't think that man necessarily needs a D/s relationship because he is weak. I don't think man was ever chivalrous because he was easily manipulated.

I think he needs it because he is too strong, whether by societal dictate or by biology. I think that man is in essence, if you strip the last 100 years of demoralization and propaganda away, actually a brute. I mean nothing degrading in that statement, on the contrary it's a compliment to my gender.

The strong man is in far more need to explore his submissive qualities than is the man who is naturally a "pansy."

Sexuality is the harmless no-brainer way of exploring that, expressing it and using it towards positive ends whereas if you did it in day to day life outside of a private relationship you'd be an ineffectual eunuch of a man.

Natural male aggression and dominance is an asset in the real world, especially in a capitalist society where Machiavelli is a guide to personal anarchy.

This dictate is, however, an albatross in the bedroom that prevents emotional exploration and sensuality. I'm suspect of any man that truly desires a push-over bimbo.

This isn't the case for all submissive men, but I suspect it's the case for a lot of submissive men. I personally think most men could stand some time under a whip.

That's my take.

Cool posts people.

Nice!

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to PerfectSurrender)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/5/2010 9:25:43 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveSubtoserve
...leave it to LA to submit the thread of the year IMO.....

That's sweet, thanks. I wouldn't go that far, but I like the answers that have been brought forth so far.

quote:

My Domme search aims for a woman i would love just in the vanilla senses of being smart, cute, nice, classy, well educated, etc etc but who happens also to need to be Domme for her own fullfillment and wants to do so with moi.

Qualities searching for in La Domme include being so nice vanilla-wise as described above and Domme-wise being into control, worship, obedience, and having a bondage kink and being an enthusiastic non-squishy sadist.

[...]

Having met and known Dommes most of my life, i do not feel any fears per se when meeting them but rather just experience the normal little voice in my head saying....i wonder what she is like, wonder if we will get along, wonder if we will be mutually attracted= just like a vanilla meet i guess.

This isn't directed at you in particular, but I see a lot of similar responses on this thread. Now obviously, the men replying on this thread are not representative of the wankers that send the emails Dommes groan about. But really, wouldn't it be great if most men took this attitude when approaching dominant women?

quote:

my intelligence and people skills,,,,,.but i also have that nasty sub trait that is often under the radar in F/m world of being fickle too ... ...good male subs are in fact just as picky as any Domme actually out there

I should hope so! If a man doesn't show me in the beginning that he isn't even just a little bit picky, I won't be interested. I just figured my number came up in the draw and he's trying his desperate shtick out on me.

quote:

ok LA.....how do i get my cookies and what kind will they be= Les Habitants cream cookies perhaps??!!

Non! Lu, Petit Écolier ;-)

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to SlaveSubtoserve)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 9:36:36 AM

SlaveSubtoserve

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....and on a deeper more serious note, as a guy sub i was a little surprised at the lack of discussion by my sub-bretheren re the ROOT causes for our lust to serve La Domme.......without getting too Freudian-lost in it i do think we can tie much of our desires back to our own Femme models in our root family and early years whether that revolve around mothers, sisters, or other strong Femme models we grew up with (egad yes that does include nuns for us Cath school boys) and the early dynamics revolving around them and us....

it is funny to note the fact that by and large MOST men in fact do NOT have these desires and needs, yet a small number of us do in fact and feel them incredibly intensely.....so again i do not want to muddy the practicality of a successful pursuit of La Domme with analytic psychology which most applied therapists ignore anyways, but i do feel it is an underlying layer of an anwer to LA's first question about WHAT in fact really MOTIVATES us to be this way ......much of what i saw as answers by my sub bretheren are in fact hoped for objective, goals, and desired results of the male sub quest and not really root motivations me-thinx ....while the answers for this root motivation are likely deeply personal and too Freudian to Board-talk them, they still are important to separate out from the successful desired effect of finding and ultimately pleasing your Domme....and from my experience probably worth examining on an individual basis for what its worth anyways.

On a side note LA, i was so disappointed that my Bruins could not play and trounce your Les Habitants in the Stanley Cups as those nasty guys from the cheese steak cityunfort beat both of our teams = ugh!

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 10:14:00 AM

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gedienstig, I agree that both people should make an effort to look attractive for each other, and that fetish clothes can really heighten the effect of some scenes. It sounds like you have realistic expectations, rather than expecting the Domme to always be glamorous, or saying that you won't obey unless she wears <whatever>.

(in reply to SlaveSubtoserve)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 4:36:59 PM

submale4u2spank

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Joined: 11/24/2006
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What is the hardest part of being a male sub?

The ratio of dommes to male subs is something like 1 to 10. This makes it very hard to get a domme, and after you get one, they can be very fickle and dump you for virtually no reason because they have so many other male subs competing for your slot.

That sucks!

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 4:54:51 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

gedienstig, I agree that both people should make an effort to look attractive for each other, and that fetish clothes can really heighten the effect of some scenes. It sounds like you have realistic expectations, rather than expecting the Domme to always be glamorous, or saying that you won't obey unless she wears <whatever>.

Well, in vanilla relationships you also need to have "normal expectations". I mean, when you wake up to a normal woman in the morning, you also kiss her good morning, even though she's not wearing make-up and has eye boogers. I think people who expect their Domme to be always glamourous, are not looking for a 24/7 relationship, but rather a free Pro Domme.

quote:

sbmale4u2spank
What is the hardest part of being a male sub?

The ratio of dommes to male subs is something like 1 to 10. This makes it very hard to get a domme, and after you get one, they can be very fickle and dump you for virtually no reason because they have so many other male subs competing for your slot.

That sucks!

But subtract the wankers who disrespectfully send their mails full of wishes to Dommes here, and you get closer to an equilibrum. I think Dommes know the value of a true submissive, and won't take anyone that is "for real" for granted and see them as something that's very interchangeable.

_____________________________

If they say why, why?
Tell 'em that it's human nature

(in reply to Andalusite)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 5:50:20 PM

submale4u2spank

Posts: 75
Joined: 11/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

sbmale4u2spank
What is the hardest part of being a male sub?

The ratio of dommes to male subs is something like 1 to 10. This makes it very hard to get a domme, and after you get one, they can be very fickle and dump you for virtually no reason because they have so many other male subs competing for your slot.

That sucks!

But subtract the wankers who disrespectfully send their mails full of wishes to Dommes here, and you get closer to an equilibrum. I think Dommes know the value of a true submissive, and won't take anyone that is "for real" for granted and see them as something that's very interchangeable.

I disagree, if you subtract the pro dommes on the site then the ratio stays. I think I was being conservative with my 1 to 10 ratio.

(in reply to gedienstig)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 8:55:50 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveSubtoserve
....and on a deeper more serious note, as a guy sub i was a little surprised at the lack of discussion by my sub-bretheren re the ROOT causes for our lust to serve La Domme.......

I think root motivations are not necessarily important for everyone. I spent a lot of time trying to figure out why I was attracted sexual to men and women or why I have the desire to show my lust through sadism. I found that the more I tried to figure it out, the more I had questions, which isn't a bad thing, necessarily. There is however a moment where I think that I spent less time thinking about why I am wired the way I am and started enjoying who I am.

If you are interested in this topic, last February I started a thread entitled Who you are. A question of determinism or did you have a choice?

quote:

On a side note LA, i was so disappointed that my Bruins could not play and trounce your Les Habitants in the Stanley Cups as those nasty guys from the cheese steak cityunfort beat both of our teams = ugh!

As they say, you win some, you lose some ;-)

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to SlaveSubtoserve)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 9:09:05 PM

Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
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quote:

quote:

sbmale4u2spank
What is the hardest part of being a male sub?

The ratio of dommes to male subs is something like 1 to 10. This makes it very hard to get a domme, and after you get one, they can be very fickle and dump you for virtually no reason because they have so many other male subs competing for your slot.

That sucks!

But subtract the wankers who disrespectfully send their mails full of wishes to Dommes here, and you get closer to an equilibrum. I think Dommes know the value of a true submissive, and won't take anyone that is "for real" for granted and see them as something that's very interchangeable.

I don't really think there is a gap. I there was, I wouldn't spend such long periods being single and seeking. I'm a relatively well adjusted woman, 37, fabulous career & education, not too hard on the eyes, no major hang ups or issues and live in a Metropolitan city. And yet, with this supposed huge pool of potential submissive men, I find a microscopic amount of men who could be a good match for me.

Why? Because I want a man to be attracted to me, all facets of me, first. I want the fact that we are both kinky to be a plus in the relationship and not the foundation of the relationship. Men who approach it this way on this site are by my guess, probably 1 in 1000, and I'm not exaggerating. Historically, I've had much more luck meeting men outside of kink-based environments, focussing on our relationship compatibility and then turning them onto it. That has it's drawbacks though as it requires helping someone sort through their desires, and not that I mind so much to go through this with someone I care about, but it ads an additional hurdle to a relationship.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to gedienstig)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/6/2010 10:29:40 PM

Posts: 1584
Joined: 5/20/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: gedienstig
Well, in vanilla relationships you also need to have "normal expectations". I mean, when you wake up to a normal woman in the morning, you also kiss her good morning, even though she's not wearing make-up and has eye boogers. I think people who expect their Domme to be always glamourous, are not looking for a 24/7 relationship, but rather a free Pro Domme.

Yep. It always astonishes me that there are so many men out there who clearly do not want a personal relationship with a real live human being who wakes up in the morning with eye boogers and wears faded bunny slippers to read on the couch for an hour before bed and needs a shoulder to cry on when her elderly mother is in the hospital. They just want to be treated to a kink extravaganza by a fetish model who has no other needs in life except to dress in sexy clothes and spank them. And they complain when they can't find a woman who will do this for them without being paid for it.

Surprise, human relationships involve humans, even if they're kinky. If you are a shitty, selfish relationship partner who isn't prepared to be loving, supportive and accepting of her as a complete human being, then you don't actually want to be in a relationship. Not one that works in the real world, anyhow. If you just want the kink and not the person, hire a pro. You aren't ready to be in a relationship. And unless you are uber-hot looking, you aren't going to do well with quick hookups either.

quote:

sbmale4u2spank
The ratio of dommes to male subs is something like 1 to 10. This makes it very hard to get a domme, and after you get one, they can be very fickle and dump you for virtually no reason because they have so many other male subs competing for your slot.

Uh, wow. Those are pretty some shallow relationships you're describing. As an ethical professional I would not even do that to my clients, and I am deeply committed to my personal relationships for the long haul. On the other hand, I would terminate a relationship if there was a serious breach of trust, so I guess it depends on what you mean by "virtually no reason".

quote:

But subtract the wankers who disrespectfully send their mails full of wishes to Dommes here, and you get closer to an equilibrum. I think Dommes know the value of a true submissive, and won't take anyone that is "for real" for granted and see them as something that's very interchangeable.

I agree. The vast majority of male "submissives" I run into on adult sites are dicks. Literally, that's all they present themselves as. If they don't have their dick in their profile picture, and many do, they spend their entire time here talking about a sexual laundry list of kinks and treating women like a kink delivery system. A parade of random dicks with apparently no real human beings behind them and no interest in treating me like a human being is utterly unattractive to me. Do not want.

When I encounter a male submissive who is friendly, intelligent, nice, personable, and doesn't haul his dick out and wave it at me by means of introduction, that's awesome. I appreciate that. Unfortunately, this kind of encounter is a lot rarer than the other kind.

If you've been leading with your dick, don't. Distinguish yourself by being a human being and treating others like human beings, and you'll stand out and be noticed by femdoms who are seeking personal relationships. Show that you *are* ready for a human relationship and you'll get one. Wave your dick around and demand kinky sexual stuff, and you'll definitely get lost in the crowd and ignored. The ratios are bullshit, and skewed on both sides by the fakes and the wankers. Be real, and human, and you'll meet others like yourself and be welcomed.

_____________________________

Your dominant Personal Trainer for fitness and body shaping in the lifestyle. Let my fetish be your motivation.

(in reply to gedienstig)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/7/2010 7:40:40 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyNTrainer

Yep. It always astonishes me that there are so many men out there who clearly do not want a personal relationship with a real live human being who wakes up in the morning with eye boogers and wears faded bunny slippers to read on the couch for an hour before bed and needs a shoulder to cry on when her elderly mother is in the hospital. They just want to be treated to a kink extravaganza by a fetish model who has no other needs in life except to dress in sexy clothes and spank them. And they complain when they can't find a woman who will do this for them without being paid for it.

It was Marilyn Monroe who said: "If you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best."

_____________________________

If they say why, why?
Tell 'em that it's human nature

(in reply to LadyNTrainer)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/7/2010 4:46:37 PM

Posts: 388
Joined: 1/1/2005
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What motivates you to be submissive?

I was born a slave. I believe that, since as far back as I can remember, I wanted to submit to a woman. Beyond that, I don't know. It is just what makes me respond.

Why do you identify yourself that way?

Because although I'm attracted to the whole bdsm scene, I much prefer being on the bottom. I enjoy serving in a number of ways. I find great satisfaction and joy in making my Owner happy and purring in content. I do like the slavery to extend beyond the bedroom, which makes me unlike many, but too me it is more honest.

What are you searching for in a Domme?

I'm not really looking anymore. I have a very full life with friends and family and my wonderful cats and dogs. I do like to come here, and occasionally go to a munch or play party. I figure if something is going to happen, it will. And I have had some great Owners over the years.

What are the qualities and attributes that you look for in a Domme?

Reality. I HATE the ads here and elsewhere that say, 'Submit to me NOW, you WORM! Send me lots and lots of money, because you know you are worthless and I am your goddess!' That is just posing, in my book.

I have desired a real life, full-time slave position in a household, perhaps poly, so I want someone who lives the lifestyle and is not just someone who thinks this is an easy way to make a few bucks.

I enjoy women who are firm, decisive, strong-willed, and, well, dominant. Someone who listens to me, but insists on making the decisions in the relationship and elsewhere.

And, of course, I enjoy a woman who enjoys beating their slaves!

What is the hardest part of being a male sub?

Not finding the woman of my dreams. I can find lots of nice women, but very few who are truly dominant. I get tired of asking my date to 'be rough with me' or 'would you spank me?'.

What kind of challenges do you face when attempting to approach a Domme?

I don't have a problem talking with anyone. I enjoy conversing with people of all stripes and orientations. I am quite verbal, sometimes to a fault. My Domme has to tell me to shut up at times. It isn't even too difficult to talk with someone about what I am looking for in a relationship.

What are you biggest fears when meeting a Domme?

Getting rejected. However, most people in the scene are nice, and will let you down gently. It's like the real world except the women are probably (on the whole) nicer personally. I like it when a woman is pleasant and sweet when she is beating the crap out of me.

What do you believe to be your best strengths and attributes? And do you feel they are often overlooked?

My best attribute is my sincerity. I am truly, madly, and deeply a slave. I feel that more times than not, honest and heart-felt slavery is taken for granted.

I can also take a good beating...

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 6/7/2010 8:18:21 PM

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Joined: 7/4/2004
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Thank you for responding trueshadow. I have to say that I'm somewhat perplexed by some of your answers.

You seem to have some pretty strong ideas about *true* dominance and submission (or slavery in your case).

quote:

I can find lots of nice women, but very few who are truly dominant.

I'm curious. How do you define a truly dominant woman?

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to trueshadow)

RE: Boys... Speak up and tell us what is it that you wa... - 7/12/2010 4:14:10 PM

SlaveSubtoserve

Posts: 282
Joined: 6/21/2006
Status: offline

Thanks LA....i'll check into that thread.

As you wisely have learned at some point it just is fine to go and enjoy being the way you/we are and leave well enough alone re root causes so.......so i can agree with that....and then again such roots may reassert themselves down the road when one least expects it without any conscious thought at all....life being that circle and all that i hear about.

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

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