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"Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 7:16:48 AM

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As someone who does believe in a higher power and spirituality, although it has nothing to do with My B&D or what I do behind closed doors. I get a bit confused when I hear some folks talk about 'Christian D/s or christian kinksters'..

With society and the church pretty much looking at us and our lifestyle as 'obscene and immoral', Id be interested in hearing others opinions on just exactly what this is and/or what it means to them.

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RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 7:22:06 AM

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Putting aside fun and games, a femsub/maledom arrangement is pretty Christian. It appears from a non Christian viewpoint to be a highly hierarchal religion. Children obey parents, wives obey husbands, husbands obey the priest/preacher, priest obeys God.

I don't know of any particular passage that says you can't take a belt to her until one or both are screaming in ecstacy.

(in reply to SirLordTrainer)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 7:23:56 AM

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http://www.collarchat.com/m_101393/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#101393
bdsm lifestyle vs christianity/religion

http://www.collarchat.com/m_112713/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#112713
bdsm spirituality???

http://www.collarchat.com/m_114995/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#114995
Christianity and ds bdsm

http://www.collarchat.com/m_154410/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#154410
a sacred take on bdsm

http://www.collarchat.com/m_168844/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#168844
bdsm and religion

http://www.collarchat.com/m_176205/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#176205
sensuality & religion = what?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_193896/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#193896
religion and bdsm

http://www.collarchat.com/m_275551/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#275551
christians everywhere!

http://www.collarchat.com/m_323932/mpage_1/key_religion%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#323932
no...not the spiritual trip

http://www.collarchat.com/m_299050/mpage_1/key_faith%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#299050
power and spirit

http://www.collarchat.com/m_133611/mpage_1/key_spirituality%252Cbdsm/tm.htm#133611
bdsm and spirituality?

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(in reply to SirLordTrainer)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 7:28:55 AM

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I belong to several Christian D/s and/or bdsm groups. Like most other interest groups, they run the gamut from ultra conservative, fundamentalist to very liberal. Although it's true that many people think of anything kinky as obscene and immoral, I'm not at all sure these people are a majority- they just make a lot of noise. They usually have skeletons in their own closets, so they focus on someone else's lifestyle rather than their own.

(in reply to Celeste43)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 7:32:12 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SirLordTrainer

As someone who does believe in a higher power and spirituality, although it has nothing to do with My B&D or what I do behind closed doors. I get a bit confused when I hear some folks talk about 'Christian D/s or christian kinksters'..

With society and the church pretty much looking at us and our lifestyle as 'obscene and immoral', Id be interested in hearing others opinions on just exactly what this is and/or what it means to them.

There are a number of christian D/s groups, that don't necessarily consider themselves "kinksters" but they do practice D/s and HOH mainly, and use biblical references for wifely submission to her husband. Those within those groups often feel outcast from the mainstream christian norm. One issue that is prevelant among the groups i know of, are about how christians don't understand that using discipline on their wives, does not equal abuse between consenting adults.

(in reply to SirLordTrainer)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 7:56:04 AM

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If you had gone to a Catholic school 30+ years ago, you'd know that Christianity and BDSM go together - them nuns will beat you for any infraction.

If you want earlier precedence - try the Spanish Inquisition.

I always laugh at that because of Mel Brook's "History of the World Part 1"

The Inquisition (what a show)
The Inquistion (here we go)
We know you're wishin' that we'd go away.
But the Inquisition's here and it's here to stay!

{Chained Jew singing}
"I was sitting in a temple. I was minding my own business.
I was listening to a lovely Hebrew mass.
Then these Papus persons plungered and they throw me in a dungeon and they shove a red hot poker up my ass - I disagree.
Is that considerate? Is that polite?
And not a tube of Preperation H in sight!"

{Chained Jew singing}
"I'm sittin' flickin' chickens and I'm lookin' throught the pickins' and suddenly thes goyim pull down valls.
I didn't even know them and they grabbed my by the scrotum and started playing ping pong with my balls!
Ooh, the agony! Ooh, the shame!
To make my privates public for a game?"

You gotta love that man ROFL

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These are my opinions - which may differ from your opinions. They may be right and just as equally wrong.

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(in reply to SirLordTrainer)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 8:00:45 AM

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Hey but the nuns beatings were non consentual! *grin

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 10:32:03 AM

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"There are a number of christian D/s groups, that don't necessarily consider themselves "kinksters" but they do practice D/s and HOH mainly, and use biblical references for wifely submission to her husband."

They are the people I referred to as conservatives or fundies. There are others who do consider D/s and bdsm to be kinky, but don't believe the Bible forbids kink. This group includes female dominants as well as males.

(in reply to raiken)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 12:31:19 PM

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Yeah I've caught onto the whole Catholic and BDSM relation already. My master is a good example of it although he no longer takes me to church. Guess the whole candles going out didn't go over too well and of course I found that funny being non-christian. Nothing like seeing the priest pale and then getting spanked later on at home. Not to mention master asking god why he had to the unfortunate one to get a druid for a slave. Well I'm off to pull master's pants down once again.

(in reply to mountainpet)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 12:43:04 PM

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Hey Im a lapsed Roman Catholic...at my Convent School (St. Ignatius, or Nuns at War, Soldiers of Christ) the lady nuns were all over 6 feet high, had maustaches, whips and canes and obviously large hands and feet. Hum, thinks? Were they nuns? Or TVs or TSs rampaging all over the covent giving out membership cards for God's BDSM club. Yep. I took a little while to sort it all out in my head.

(in reply to subartist4dom)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 1:25:57 PM

Arpig

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Christian BDSM.....does the phrase "Have your cake and eat it to" ring a bell?

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(in reply to SirLordTrainer)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 1:31:52 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SirLordTrainer

As someone who does believe in a higher power and spirituality, although it has nothing to do with My B&D or what I do behind closed doors. I get a bit confused when I hear some folks talk about 'Christian D/s or christian kinksters'..

With society and the church pretty much looking at us and our lifestyle as 'obscene and immoral', Id be interested in hearing others opinions on just exactly what this is and/or what it means to them.

I think it has as much value as someone saying they practice Moselm BDSM or Jewish BDSM or Druidish BDSM or Latino BDSM or Republican BDSM or Communist BDSM....

I see it as a sign that they are looking for as many ways to reassure themselves of some identity because they really aren't very secure at all that doing BDSM is for them. OR maybe they are just trying to shove their personl beliefs and identity onto others because unless others can validate them they can't be really part of that group.

I suppose some folks could say that same thing about any claim to being part of any group but I think when you add in other terms onto one group identity it suggests great insecurity about your own identity.

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And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to SirLordTrainer)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 1:43:54 PM

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I am a Christian and a slave, but I don't know that I have ever put the two together in my head. I do know that a lot just look at it as a wife submitting to their husband, and the man being head of household.

I suppose there are those that choose to put it together and I have read one or two websites on it. From what I noticed though, they were okay, but they would say being gay was wrong, or this was wrong..etc..yet, they could turn any verse they wanted to in the Bible for their use. So, I never saw any reason to look into that part of it any further.

I think I can keep my faith, and be a slave, but I don't see putting them together and giving cause to being what I am.

Masters Akasha

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RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 2:21:51 PM

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but it makes so Kewel!!!!!

I'm now anticipating BDSM Accountant, BDSM Hairdresser, BDSMGarbage Collector, BDSMOpera Singer.. wow.. it just opens up a whole new world.... and guess what, it's all good!!!!

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I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

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RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 2:33:09 PM

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i may be wrong...i still have a lot of learning to do...but i've always thought of Christian D/s as a relationship based on biblical teaching. Please note, that i'm talking about the relationship part of D/s, not the kink. That's how i view it.

i've been looking for a local Christian D/s group primarily because i would like to find a Dom who shares the same Christian values as i do and would want to be involved in a Christian church community.

i don't see the kink as anyone's business but our own.

(in reply to LotusSong)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 5:07:19 PM

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A few thoughts, and thank you to LuckyAlabtros for other resources. As I see it, Christians can be into the lifestyle, as long as the sex is with their spouse, and they don't, for example, commit some other sins like fobidden bestiality, or public sex as that would be immodest.Christinas marriags would probably last longer if they had the sense of play, discovery, and variety, with D/S that I see here, although the slave component is questionable to me I would need to study more.There are references to wives not denying their husband sexually, unless it is agreed upon, there are references to wives submitting to their husbands,repecting husbands and the husbands loving their wives. So, discipline with love would be a good thing, just as one should not spare the rod to spoil the child, but you still love the child you are training . I don't say all women need this type of discipline,(and I bet some would feel hated by a spanking or whipping) for some a glare may be enough, but if the man needs to do some spanking to be sexually pleased...she should submit out of love and obedience and sacrafice, "as unto the Lord".I was recalling some submission of Sarah's in the OT, I believe she passed herself off as Abrahams sister, and a king fell for her, thinking she was datable( : and God got angry with Abrahams deciet, and caused barreness in the land. Abraham had passed Sarah off as sister as he feared the King, or wanted some favor from that King, but God got angry with his deceit, and then the King found out Sarah was married, and he gave her back to Abraham, as he knew that was the cause of the barreness in his Kingdom.I believe scripture is silent about any sex having taken place, yet Sarahs general submissive attitude towards Abraham was later on honored! That really surprised me when I frist read it. I wish I had all the references, but a bit pressed for time.I will do more research on this topic, after checking out LA's links. To curious believers it would be worthy of a study in scripture, as often one thinks something is not okay (going only by what is commonly practiced) when it actually is fine with God, and a pleasure He readily allows.
Maryelena

(in reply to subdelicious)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 5:19:16 PM

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We are both Christian, Angel has been all his life, and I am just joining the church. The only impact it has on us is that we are ot sexually involved (by his request) and we are not public to make sure no one finds out about us in the community. Beyond that, the two dont really intersect.

My 2 cents
DV

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(in reply to maryelena)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 5:21:49 PM

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Hello A/all,

After reading this thread, I find myself puzzled.

To me, there is a difference between religion, spirituality, and church.

There was a quote I read once, and for the life of me I cannot remember who stated it, but it went something like...

"Man, for all his wisdom, tends to worship Gods who show all of the personality characteristics of a two year old."

While I know that Paul, and the modern Christian church, tend to have their knickers in a wad about sex and sexuality, this is actually fairly common with established religions. When I was studying this in college, I read a number of books which proposed that the reason Organized Religion has such a deep distrust of sex and sexuality is that, as a biological imperative, it will trump Religious Faith.

So given the fact that a Church can discuss higher spirituality and faith all day long, odds are fairly good that the drive of the species to procreate is going to win out in the long run.

For myself, I have difficulty believing in a supreme entity with a plan for Life, The Universe, and Everything (42) who would design a life form with biological imperatives to procreate, build in a sex drive to make that happen, create all sorts of glandular fall-out from pain and sex and excitement and the like.

And then turn around and say "dont do it."

Sounds so much like something from that comedy sketch "Rules of a Toddler"

I see it, it is mine.
I want it, it is mine.
I gave it to you but I want it back, it is mine.

For me, I believe a person should be allowed to worship in their own way to their own God(s) or lake thereof. I myself dont see any contradiction between the teachings of Jesus Christ and WIITWD.

Just me, could be wrong, but there you go.

Sinergy

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(in reply to maryelena)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 5:25:33 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ToGiveDivine

If you had gone to a Catholic school 30+ years ago, you'd know that Christianity and BDSM go together - them nuns will beat you for any infraction.

All the kinkiest human beings I have ever met in my life--male and female--have been Catholic. In fact, my second girlfriend was the one who first dressed me up as a schoolgirl. She had this fantasy about being the Good Girl and me being the Friend Who Was a Very Bad Influence.

*shakes her head happily* Ah, memories.

--M

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)

RE: "Christian" BDSM? - 10/25/2006 8:22:42 PM

Mavis

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So much disjointed logic all because two basic precepts are assumed, then combined to make a rule based on two erroneous "factoids"... the rule itself is damned.

1. BDSM always incorporates sex
2. Sex is bad
Therefore BDSM must be bad

pffft. D.D folks ("Domestic Discipline") do tend to go with the Patriarchal view that the natural order is male Top/ female bottom, and some disavow any association with erotic pleasure in their disciplinary spankings, but some are active spanking enthusiasts in their own right. Personally, i love the dynamic that places the Dom in the position of being answerable to the higher power for His management of me, while i also retain responsibility to answer to either or both. i actually feel spiritually moved when my behavior is acceptable to my god, and my lead gets a pat on the head for it from His lead.. Maybe it's a chain of authority kink? lol..

i guess like... how one might feel if they did a good job on a work project, and their immediate supervisor got a promotion for having the foresight to choose a good project workers. Very cool IF you liked the supervisor.

(in reply to Morrigel)

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